Is that any job in Canada?  What you describe IS true for most government workers and union workers.

Yes it is in Canada  for almost all jobs true. We are protected under the law and the employers can not just do what they want. These protections can be circumvented even in Canada.  Simply move the unwanted employee around so much and reduce their job duties, that they quit. At this point you are 100% right. The employers always find a way to get you out of the company if they dont want you. But does it really matter which way you left the company? Fact is I still don’t a have job. HappyPolarBear /me just having a depressing day today.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is that any job in Canada?  What you describe IS true for most government workers and union workers. But, in the USA, they do have to tell you why, unless they lay you off. The big difference is that if you are laid off, you are eligible for unemployment. If you are fired for cause, you don’t get unemployment. Now the law suits come forth!  And that same 6 month rule can apply in the USA–depending on the court and state. There are many ways for employers to get around this, such as hiring only part time people or hiring people to "try out" and never end the trial period. Then there are right to work, or work at will states–employees have no rights. Nevada is a good example. All of this is to protect the line worker from loosing a job when they did everything right.  It is also to help Affirmative Action programs, so people aren’t let go based on race, origin, nationality, sexual preference, disability, etc. I got So sick of people coming to me and saying they didn’t get this job, or this assignment, or some promotion, when they never bothered to apply in the first place.  I still, to this day, do not understand how stupid people can be. Some people think they have some form of entitlement to a job. In any case, labor law is a big business in the USA–so there are lots of law suits out there for wrongful terminations. These protections can be circumvented even in Canada.  Simply move the unwanted employee around so much and reduce their job duties, that they quit.  A very well worn strategy that works way too often.  IMO FWIW, Nancy

Response:

permanently into the ether: But does it really matter which way you left the company? Fact is I still don’t a have job.

I’m really not familiar with the Canadian system, so I can’t speak to any programs or benefits you might or might not qualify for due to how you were let go. The bottom line, anywhere in the world, is that how you are let go will directly determine how difficult it will be to find other employment.  One of the key questions asked on any application is why you left jobs.  You want a non-attention getting answer.  :) Nancy Just knockin’ around the zoo. (James Taylor)

Response:

into the ether: Any job.  He worked for a private company, and everybody had the same protection.  I thought California was an "at will" employer.

No, far from it.  California is one of the most employee friendly states. As far as I know they don’t have to tell me anything except "good-bye".  I would  get unemployment, though, unless they fired me for a cause.  But what’s the difference, anyway, if they lay me off or just fire me.  I’m still out of work.

The difference is your future.  If you get fired for cause, you really can’t hide that from a future employer.  also, think of the reference you would receive from an employer who fired you for cause. If you are laid off–there needn’t be a reason for the lay off.  This makes it MUCH easier to find future employment.  Your reason for leaving is "laid off" and you don’t need to say anything further.  Unemployment is supposed to tide you over until you can find another job. Some employers will allow you to quit, rather than fire you for cause.  You loose unemployment this way, but you also have no paper trail of what happened and why you left that employer. Additionally, you can be fired on the spot for certain causes (such as doing drugs on the job), but if you are laid off, there is normally some form of notice and sometimes severance pay. Keep in mind that the court system upholds these protections.  California labor law is very complex, which is why you need a good attorney, if you want to fight your employer. I recently read about a man who was fired–no reason given about 15 years ago. He sued his employer for wrongful termination and he won $4.1 million in back pay and damages.  These cases take years and you have to go on with life while you are suing your former employer. If you work for a larger company (over 200 employees), you should see the writing on the wall.  IOW, larger companies have very specific procedures for lay off or firing with cause.  You are going to get warnings.  You will get counseling from your supervisor.  You will get corrective action memos.  Many things and lots of time will pass–so you should be fully warned that something is about to happen.   None of this is required in an at will state.  There doesn’t have to be any reason to let you go. (sort of) HTH, Nancy Just knockin’ around the zoo. (James Taylor)

Response:

Any job.  He worked for a private company, and everybody had the same protection.  I thought California was an "at will" employer.  As far as I know they don’t have to tell me anything except "good-bye".  I would  get unemployment, though, unless they fired me for a cause.  But what’s the difference, anyway, if they lay me off or just fire me.  I’m still out of work. Diane

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is that any job in Canada?  What you describe IS true for most government workers and union workers. But, in the USA, they do have to tell you why, unless they lay you off. The big difference is that if you are laid off, you are eligible for unemployment. If you are fired for cause, you don’t get unemployment. Now the law suits come forth!  And that same 6 month rule can apply in the USA–depending on the court and state. There are many ways for employers to get around this, such as hiring only part time people or hiring people to "try out" and never end the trial period. Then there are right to work, or work at will states–employees have no rights. Nevada is a good example. All of this is to protect the line worker from loosing a job when they did everything right.  It is also to help Affirmative Action programs, so people aren’t let go based on race, origin, nationality, sexual preference, disability, etc. I got So sick of people coming to me and saying they didn’t get this job, or this assignment, or some promotion, when they never bothered to apply in the first place.  I still, to this day, do not understand how stupid people can be. Some people think they have some form of entitlement to a job. In any case, labor law is a big business in the USA–so there are lots of law suits out there for wrongful terminations. These protections can be circumvented even in Canada.  Simply move the unwanted employee around so much and reduce their job duties, that they quit.  A very well worn strategy that works way too often.  IMO FWIW, Nancy

Response:

Is that any job in Canada?  What you describe IS true for most government workers and union workers. But, in the USA, they do have to tell you why, unless they lay you off.  The big difference is that if you are laid off, you are eligible for unemployment.  If you are fired for cause, you don’t get unemployment. Now the law suits come forth!  And that same 6 month rule can apply in the USA–depending on the court and state. There are many ways for employers to get around this, such as hiring only part time people or hiring people to "try out" and never end the trial period. Then there are right to work, or work at will states–employees have no rights. Nevada is a good example. All of this is to protect the line worker from loosing a job when they did everything right.  It is also to help Affirmative Action programs, so people aren’t let go based on race, origin, nationality, sexual preference, disability, etc. I got So sick of people coming to me and saying they didn’t get this job, or this assignment, or some promotion, when they never bothered to apply in the first place.  I still, to this day, do not understand how stupid people can be. Some people think they have some form of entitlement to a job. In any case, labor law is a big business in the USA–so there are lots of law suits out there for wrongful terminations. These protections can be circumvented even in Canada.  Simply move the unwanted employee around so much and reduce their job duties, that they quit.  A very well worn strategy that works way too often.  IMO FWIW, Nancy into the ether: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I was shocked when my husband described Canadian job protection programs to me.  According to him, a company can’t simply fire a person without cause. They have to have a reason, and it had better be a good one or they will get sued.  If they "lay off" someone because their job is being eliminated, then that person may sue them if they open a similar position in the company within 6 months.  It’s really hard to terminate someone, except for violence at the workplace.  Getting into a physical fight results in instant termination, sometimes even if it isn’t your fault.  He was pretty shocked when I told him that I can be fired with no reason given at any time.  I’ve learned a lot about other forms of government from him.  The funny thing is that so many things Canadian seem so much better to me – but he really prefer’s the U.S. model.  Go figure. I guess it’s a case of grass being greener. Diane Hi Carmen- In the USA, if you have a 4 yr degree, they usually won’t let you into any special programs, because you are already highly trained.  So, you have an opportunity that many people don’t get. There are many ways they can give you more time on tests–ask what the procedure is.   One of the ways we (USA) do it in special education in public schools is for everyone to take the test.  When the teacher says time is up, you stop with everyone else while the tests are collected and everyone leaves, except those who get more time.  Those like you will be allowed to finish the test without all the classmates being around.  Sometimes this is a problem for the student, as the test is interrupted and the test "mood" is gone.  You have to tell them, if this is so. Sometimes, you take it after class. HTH, Nancy permanently into the ether: thanks Heather, I am in Canada but I think we have the same rules. How can I get extra time on tests and other assistance without other students noticing. I never was  someone who want a special treatment but then I have changed and having concentration problems doesn’t make things easier for me, maybe I will have to asked for that extra help. Carmen He recommended and also people from my support group too to apply at the school for disability arrangements. I have a problem with that. I already have a very hard time to even accept and acknowledge that I am bipolar. Now am I supposed to go to the school assessment center and asked for special needs help e.g. longer time on tests…meaning openly admit that I am mentally ill. I am not disabled. I don’t know what country you are in, but I do know that in the United States, even a learning disability like dyslexia requires that students have special needs, such as longer time on tests.  By law, they CAN NOT disclose what your "disability" is, and those records are kept confidential and locked away where only a select few can see them. Basically, no one except for a couple of people will know you are mentally ill.  Everyone else will think that you have a learning disability, something rather common in the United States.

Response:

I was shocked when my husband described Canadian job protection programs to me.  According to him, a company can’t simply fire a person without cause. They have to have a reason, and it had better be a good one or they will get sued.  If they "lay off" someone because their job is being eliminated, then that person may sue them if they open a similar position in the company within 6 months.  It’s really hard to terminate someone, except for violence at the workplace.  Getting into a physical fight results in instant termination, sometimes even if it isn’t your fault.  He was pretty shocked when I told him that I can be fired with no reason given at any time.  I’ve learned a lot about other forms of government from him.  The funny thing is that so many things Canadian seem so much better to me – but he really prefer’s the U.S. model.  Go figure. I guess it’s a case of grass being greener. Diane

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Carmen- In the USA, if you have a 4 yr degree, they usually won’t let you into any special programs, because you are already highly trained.  So, you have an opportunity that many people don’t get. There are many ways they can give you more time on tests–ask what the procedure is.   One of the ways we (USA) do it in special education in public schools is for everyone to take the test.  When the teacher says time is up, you stop with everyone else while the tests are collected and everyone leaves, except those who get more time.  Those like you will be allowed to finish the test without all the classmates being around.  Sometimes this is a problem for the student, as the test is interrupted and the test "mood" is gone.  You have to tell them, if this is so. Sometimes, you take it after class. HTH, Nancy permanently into the ether: thanks Heather, I am in Canada but I think we have the same rules. How can I get extra time on tests and other assistance without other students noticing. I never was  someone who want a special treatment but then I have changed and having concentration problems doesn’t make things easier for me, maybe I will have to asked for that extra help. Carmen He recommended and also people from my support group too to apply at the school for disability arrangements. I have a problem with that. I already have a very hard time to even accept and acknowledge that I am bipolar. Now am I supposed to go to the school assessment center and asked for special needs help e.g. longer time on tests…meaning openly admit that I am mentally ill. I am not disabled. I don’t know what country you are in, but I do know that in the United States, even a learning disability like dyslexia requires that students have special needs, such as longer time on tests.  By law, they CAN NOT disclose what your "disability" is, and those records are kept confidential and locked away where only a select few can see them. Basically, no one except for a couple of people will know you are mentally ill.  Everyone else will think that you have a learning disability, something rather common in the United States.

Response:

"I can’t be mentally ill".  I bought societies image of mentally ill people – the image of people with hollow eyes, and a crazed look, often living on the streets because they couldn’t function as full members of society.  I wasn’t like that.

Wow Diane, that’s exactly what I think and imagine when ever I see the box in questionnaires "Are you disabled?" "Are you mentally ill?" Thanks for the encouragement. — HappyPolarBear

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Sometimes you write things that literally make me flash back to when I was first diagnosed.  I remember the first months, thinking "I can’t be mentally ill".  I bought societies image of mentally ill people – the image of people with hollow eyes, and a crazed look, often living on the streets because they couldn’t function as full members of society.  I wasn’t like that. Eventually, my mental image of "mentally ill" changed to encompass people who have managable conditions, who need to adapt their lifestyle to cope. I think that you are thinking the same way about "disabled" as I was about "mentally ill". A lot of people need special adaptations to cope with life.  The most obvious ones are the blind and deaf.  But a lot of peple have disabilities that are subtler, and need a bit of help in order to be able to live full lives and contribute to society.   Do you read "For Better Or For Worse"? Yes, the comic strip.  This weeks series talked about a girl who needed help in school because she couldn’t recognize the written word – she had to tape everything and have a special assistant.  Should she simply have to give up school, because her disability is not common, and not visible? Of course not.  It isn’t good for her, and it isn’t good for society.  Even non-disabled people sometimes need special accommodations:  I have two co-workers who have had to take a lot of time off work, one because of problems with menopause and the other because of some mysterious heart ailment.  Another man – an important VP – had to take time off to deal with his wife who had cancer.  The owner had to take a lot of time to deal with premature twins.  All of these people required special accomodations, that we made willingly because it was the right thing to do. It’s better for society that you get the training you need to work, as much as you can.  If that means you need a little longer to take tests because of anxiety, then so be it.  The alternative is that they put you in a low level job that really doesn’t suit you, and you will end up more anxious and probably on permanent disability.  Some bp’ers can’t work, but most can, and I strontgly believe that if you have the chance you should work all you can. Work provides structure and emotional rewards and social stability, as well as financial stability. In short (I know, too late <g)… take whatever help you need to get the training you need.  It’s in your best interests, and societies best interests.  And remember – you have been gradually improving since you were diagnosed.  You may not notice it, but as one who has been communicating with you for a while, I can see it.  You’re sharper now than you were 3 months ago, and I’m betting that you will get sharper as you adapt to the limitations of being bipolar and being on meds.  Life isn’t static.  You may not always need the help.  But as long as you do, take it.  Don’t let bipolarity stop you from being all you can be. Diane I am feeling restless and can’t think straight. I am in the middle of making a decision for going back to school. I want to become a Paralegal. Now here is the dilemma. I had some Aptitude tests and the result show that yes I work accurate but because of the time factor I didn’t finished to many questions. I blanked out and couldn’t even do a simple multiplication as 6 times 4. As time got shorter I started panicking more and more until I simply run out of time, therefore the test results are lousy. According to the tests result my English is like a grade 8 student and my math skills are even worse.  I don’t understand that and asked my instructor how I could have graduated from college as the best in my class with Scholar  if my English is that bad. He than said that one of the problems is my memory problem ( I had to read some paragraphs several time) and my continue checking over to make sure I did it right and of course the time factor worked in my disadvantage. He recommended and also people from my support group too to apply at the school for disability arrangements. I have a problem with that. I already have a very hard time to even accept and acknowledge that I am bipolar. Now am I supposed to go to the school assessment center and asked for special needs help e.g. longer time on tests…meaning openly admit that I am mentally ill. I am not disabled. I would like to know what you guys/girls think about that. I would appreciate any advice, experiences or opinion. thanks HappyPolarBear

Response:

Hi Carmen- In the USA, if you have a 4 yr degree, they usually won’t let you into any special programs, because you are already highly trained.  So, you have an opportunity that many people don’t get. There are many ways they can give you more time on tests–ask what the procedure is.   One of the ways we (USA) do it in special education in public schools is for everyone to take the test.  When the teacher says time is up, you stop with everyone else while the tests are collected and everyone leaves, except those who get more time.  Those like you will be allowed to finish the test without all the classmates being around.  Sometimes this is a problem for the student, as the test is interrupted and the test "mood" is gone.  You have to tell them, if this is so. Sometimes, you take it after class. HTH, Nancy permanently into the ether: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -thanks Heather, I am in Canada but I think we have the same rules. How can I get extra time on tests and other assistance without other students noticing. I never was  someone who want a special treatment but then I have changed and having concentration problems doesn’t make things easier for me, maybe I will have to asked for that extra help. Carmen He recommended and also people from my support group too to apply at the school for disability arrangements. I have a problem with that. I already have a very hard time to even accept and acknowledge that I am bipolar. Now am I supposed to go to the school assessment center and asked for special needs help e.g. longer time on tests…meaning openly admit that I am mentally ill. I am not disabled. I don’t know what country you are in, but I do know that in the United States, even a learning disability like dyslexia requires that students have special needs, such as longer time on tests.  By law, they CAN NOT disclose what your "disability" is, and those records are kept confidential and locked away where only a select few can see them. Basically, no one except for a couple of people will know you are mentally ill.  Everyone else will think that you have a learning disability, something rather common in the United States.

Response:

HBP, Have you considered that part of the problem could be your brain adjusting to not having nicotine? This last week, since I stepped down on the patch, my brain fog has been much worse! We tend to forget that nicotine is a drug. Part of it could be the meds plus the loss of nicotine… either way it is something that will improve. The most important thing is doing what *you* want. If you can get some help then you should take it and use it. You shouldn’t feel bad about asking for help! You aren’t taking advantage or asking for something that you don’t need. Think of it as doing something to help assure that you accomplish your dream. Rebecca – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Your tests sounds similar to what I had. One full week of testing and it was so exhausting. On my last test I didn’t even care anymore, I just marked of anything. Overmedication? No I don’t think so. I am finally stable. I think some of the memory problem is caused by meds maybe Lithium or Seroquel but I think this side effect is worth it as I hardly feel the irritation I had before and was unable to function. Now I function properly can even spent the whole day in a class where we learn how to write resumes. Is tierening and I have some problems to concentrate but I can do it. So I am hoping that I get my course approved and I can study to become my dream job as a Paralegal. HappyPolarBear

Response:

I guess I will have to put pride aside if I want to become a Paralegal. I will have to go back to school for a full year. So if the price is to acknowledge that I am mentally ill, then so be it. I guess pride is on the wrong place. If I am too proud now and fail later I may regret it. Thanks for pointing that out. — HappyPolarBear

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You are what you are. Bipolar is a recognized disability. Put pride or ego aside and try it to see if it can make a positive difference in the outcome of the testing. Nothing ventured nothing gained.

Response:

Your tests sounds similar to what I had. One full week of testing and it was so exhausting. On my last test I didn’t even care anymore, I just marked of anything. Overmedication? No I don’t think so. I am finally stable. I think some of the memory problem is caused by meds maybe Lithium or Seroquel but I think this side effect is worth it as I hardly feel the irritation I had before and was unable to function. Now I function properly can even spent the whole day in a class where we learn how to write resumes. Is tierening and I have some problems to concentrate but I can do it. So I am hoping that I get my course approved and I can study to become my dream job as a Paralegal. HappyPolarBear

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Now here is the dilemma. I had some Aptitude tests and the result show that yes I work accurate but because of the time factor I didn’t finished to many questions. I blanked out and couldn’t even do a simple multiplication as 6 times 4. As time got shorter I started panicking more and more until I simply run out of time, therefore the test results are lousy. According to the tests result my English is like a grade 8 student and my math skills are even worse.  I don’t understand that and asked my instructor how I could have graduated from college as the best in my class with Scholar  if my English is that bad. He than said that one of the problems is my memory problem ( I had to read some paragraphs several time) and my continue checking over to make sure I did it right and of course the time factor worked in my disadvantage. thanks HappyPolarBear HPB: I, too, have a Masters Degree from a highly selective school, and yet, early in this 4 1/2 year disabiltiy adventure I was turned down for Voc. Rehab because I was determined to be too disabled to be able to take advantage of their program. They sent me to a 40 hour 1 week program at a profession evaluation center where I took nothing but tests, tests, tests.  I think my verbal was rated at the 12 grade level, which may have been as high has their ratings went, but my math was reported at the 8th grade or less level, despite the fact that’ I’d bumbled through calculus in college. I could barely do simple math.  When it came to the Manual Dexterity tests, I did so poorly on the first four tests, one of which invlvolved producing a woven leather belt, that I threw a tantrum and told them  that I would cheerfully accept a zero in this section but would absolutely not subject myself to more testing in this area.  (I was carrying a Vennetta Bottega woven leather purse which I’d had been easily able to afford while working most of my adult life before becoming disabled with BP……like I was just dying to get a job in a leather working factory!) A large part of the problem was the fact that I was not on a mood stablizer and was doped to the gills on Exxeffor (300 mg per day) which resulted in hand tremors so bad that my bank called to see if someone had forged my name on at $15.60 check to the Pizza Hut, where I’ve been a longtime frequent check writing  customer. I I was so doped up that I’d stay home for 4 or 5 days rather than venturing 2 blocks to rhe convenience store to buy cigarrettes.  Complete nicotine withdrawl, feeding Stoffers to my pets rather going to the grocery to buy dog food at least twice a month was just no big deal.  Yeah, I should have just quit smoking then…very easily, but didn’t.  don’t know why. Often…10 times a day, I’d go into a room, trying to find  something and couldn’t quite remember what I was looking for. Any possibility that you are over medicated with something that disagrees with you?  When I switched p-docs and got on the right combo of meds these problems disapated dramatically and significantly. As you can see….BTDT and completly relate to what you’re going through! BTW:  They weren’t able to detect, or at least didn’t mention,  the lifetime slight dyslexia that is no secret to anyone who’s read me on news groups. Charming! Maggie

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am feeling restless and can’t think straight. I am in the middle of making a decision for going back to school. I want to become a Paralegal. Now here is the dilemma. I had some Aptitude tests and the result show that yes I work accurate but because of the time factor I didn’t finished to many questions. I blanked out and couldn’t even do a simple multiplication as 6 times 4. As time got shorter I started panicking more and more until I simply run out of time, therefore the test results are lousy. According to the tests result my English is like a grade 8 student and my math skills are even worse.  I don’t understand that and asked my instructor how I could have graduated from college as the best in my class with Scholar  if my English is that bad. He than said that one of the problems is my memory problem ( I had to read some paragraphs several time) and my continue checking over to make sure I did it right and of course the time factor worked in my disadvantage. He recommended and also people from my support group too to apply at the school for disability arrangements. I have a problem with that. I already have a very hard time to even accept and acknowledge that I am bipolar. Now am I supposed to go to the school assessment center and asked for special  needs help e.g. longer time on tests…meaning openly admit that I am mentally ill. I am not disabled. I would like to know what you guys/girls think about that. I would appreciate any advice, experiences or opinion.

Perfectly grammatical English. You obviously don’t have a problem with English. Can you use a calculator? I don’t see a problem with maths for law. What the tests are designed to do is to weed out people from the lower social classes, who tend not to have had particularly good schooling. However they are also catching you, since they cannot distinguish problems in concentration from low social class. Since it is a school and not a job personally I wouldn’t have a problem about being totally upfront about my bipolar. I ticked the box for "mental health problem" at Leeds. So far it has only had an effect once, maybe. On a field course I was getting stressed about the amount of work we had to do. Some of the tasks were timewasters because some people were working on bats, which are active only at night, so had nothing to do during the day, so they gave us all some tasks involving identifying plants and the like to keep them busy. I was told I needn’t do those, which meant I could devote full time to my main project.

Response:

thanks Colleen, I agree the first step is fully to accept that being Bipolar is now part of me. And knowing that I will have it for the rest of my life I will have to work with it not against it. I will have to learn not to be ashamed of it. I can’t run away from it neither can I hide from it. It is there and always will be. — HappyPolarBear

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – When I was in college (graduated ‘98 so it’s recent) I was the VP of the Disabled Advocates group.  We made sure students had the allowances they needed for their individual problems.  There is nothing wrong with needing allowances to complete your studies.  You truly need them.  I agree with Lindy.  You need to learn to accept that you have bipolar.  You don’t need to identify yourself by it but it is a part of you.  It doesn’t make you less or more intelligent.  It doesn’t make you a criminal, unless you choose to be, and it isn’t your fault.  It’s a medical condition.  If you had limited vision would you not seek the help you need?  What you experience is not different. IMO take the help and then use you education to the best of your advantage. c I am feeling restless and can’t think straight. I am in the middle of making a decision for going back to school. I want to become a Paralegal. Now here is the dilemma. I had some Aptitude tests and the result show that yes I work accurate but because of the time factor I didn’t finished to many questions. I blanked out and couldn’t even do a simple multiplication as 6 times 4. As time got shorter I started panicking more and more until I simply run out of time, therefore the test results are lousy. According to the tests result my English is like a grade 8 student and my math skills are even worse.  I don’t understand that and asked my instructor how I could have graduated from college as the best in my class with Scholar  if my English is that bad. He than said that one of the problems is my memory problem ( I had to read some paragraphs several time) and my continue checking over to make sure I did it right and of course the time factor worked in my disadvantage. He recommended and also people from my support group too to apply at the school for disability arrangements. I have a problem with that. I already have a very hard time to even accept and acknowledge that I am bipolar. Now am I supposed to go to the school assessment center and asked for special needs help e.g. longer time on tests…meaning openly admit that I am mentally ill. I am not disabled. I would like to know what you guys/girls think about that. I would appreciate any advice, experiences or opinion. thanks HappyPolarBear

Response:

thanks Malcolm, that sounds encouraging. Maybe I am lucky too and get a good school, I am convinced with a little bit of extra help I can do the schooling again. — HappyPolarBear

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am feeling restless and can’t think straight. I am in the middle of making a decision for going back to school. I want to become a Paralegal. Now here is the dilemma. I had some Aptitude tests and the result show that yes I work accurate but because of the time factor I didn’t finished to many questions. I blanked out and couldn’t even do a simple multiplication as 6 times 4. As time got shorter I started panicking more and more until I simply run out of time, therefore the test results are lousy. According to the tests result my English is like a grade 8 student and my math skills are even worse.  I don’t understand that and asked my instructor how I could have graduated from college as the best in my class with Scholar  if my English is that bad. He than said that one of the problems is my memory problem ( I had to read some paragraphs several time) and my continue checking over to make sure I did it right and of course the time factor worked in my disadvantage. He recommended and also people from my support group too to apply at the school for disability arrangements. I have a problem with that. I already have a very hard time to even accept and acknowledge that I am bipolar. Now am I supposed to go to the school assessment center and asked for special  needs help e.g. longer time on tests…meaning openly admit that I am mentally ill. I am not disabled. I would like to know what you guys/girls think about that. I would appreciate any advice, experiences or opinion. Perfectly grammatical English. You obviously don’t have a problem with English. Can you use a calculator? I don’t see a problem with maths for law. What the tests are designed to do is to weed out people from the lower social classes, who tend not to have had particularly good schooling. However they are also catching you, since they cannot distinguish problems in concentration from low social class. Since it is a school and not a job personally I wouldn’t have a problem about being totally upfront about my bipolar. I ticked the box for "mental health problem" at Leeds. So far it has only had an effect once, maybe. On a field course I was getting stressed about the amount of work we had to do. Some of the tasks were timewasters because some people were working on bats, which are active only at night, so had nothing to do during the day, so they gave us all some tasks involving identifying plants and the like to keep them busy. I was told I needn’t do those, which meant I could devote full time to my main project.

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thanks Heather, I am in Canada but I think we have the same rules. How can I get extra time on tests and other assistance without other students noticing. I never was  someone who want a special treatment but then I have changed and having concentration problems doesn’t make things easier for me, maybe I will have to asked for that extra help. Carmen

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – He recommended and also people from my support group too to apply at the school for disability arrangements. I have a problem with that. I already have a very hard time to even accept and acknowledge that I am bipolar. Now am I supposed to go to the school assessment center and asked for special needs help e.g. longer time on tests…meaning openly admit that I am mentally ill. I am not disabled. I don’t know what country you are in, but I do know that in the United States, even a learning disability like dyslexia requires that students have special needs, such as longer time on tests.  By law, they CAN NOT disclose what your "disability" is, and those records are kept confidential and locked away where only a select few can see them. Basically, no one except for a couple of people will know you are mentally ill.  Everyone else will think that you have a learning disability, something rather common in the United States.

Response:

Now here is the dilemma. I had some Aptitude tests and the result show that yes I work accurate but because of the time factor I didn’t finished to many questions. I blanked out and couldn’t even do a simple multiplication as 6 times 4. As time got shorter I started panicking more and more until I simply run out of time, therefore the test results are lousy. According to the tests result my English is like a grade 8 student and my math skills are even worse.  I don’t understand that and asked my instructor how I could have graduated from college as the best in my class with Scholar  if my English is that bad. He than said that one of the problems is my memory problem ( I had to read some paragraphs several time) and my continue checking over to make sure I did it right and of course the time factor worked in my disadvantage. thanks HappyPolarBear

HPB: I, too, have a Masters Degree from a highly selective school, and yet, early in this 4 1/2 year disabiltiy adventure I was turned down for Voc. Rehab because I was determined to be too disabled to be able to take advantage of their program. They sent me to a 40 hour 1 week program at a profession evaluation center where I took nothing but tests, tests, tests.  I think my verbal was rated at the 12 grade level, which may have been as high has their ratings went, but my math was reported at the 8th grade or less level, despite the fact that’ I’d bumbled through calculus in college. I could barely do simple math.  When it came to the Manual Dexterity tests, I did so poorly on the first four tests, one of which invlvolved producing a woven leather belt, that I threw a tantrum and told them  that I would cheerfully accept a zero in this section but would absolutely not subject myself to more testing in this area.  (I was carrying a Vennetta Bottega woven leather purse which I’d had been easily able to afford while working most of my adult life before becoming disabled with BP……like I was just dying to get a job in a leather working factory!) A large part of the problem was the fact that I was not on a mood stablizer and was doped to the gills on Exxeffor (300 mg per day) which resulted in hand tremors so bad that my bank called to see if someone had forged my name on at $15.60 check to the Pizza Hut, where I’ve been a longtime frequent check writing  customer. I I was so doped up that I’d stay home for 4 or 5 days rather than venturing 2 blocks to rhe convenience store to buy cigarrettes.  Complete nicotine withdrawl, feeding Stoffers to my pets rather going to the grocery to buy dog food at least twice a month was just no big deal.  Yeah, I should have just quit smoking then…very easily, but didn’t.  don’t know why. Often…10 times a day, I’d go into a room, trying to find  something and couldn’t quite remember what I was looking for. Any possibility that you are over medicated with something that disagrees with you?   When I switched p-docs and got on the right combo of meds these problems disapated dramatically and significantly. As you can see….BTDT and completly relate to what you’re going through! BTW:  They weren’t able to detect, or at least didn’t mention,  the lifetime slight dyslexia that is no secret to anyone who’s read me on news groups. Charming! Maggie

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You are what you are. Bipolar is a recognized disability. Put pride or ego aside and try it to see if it can make a positive difference in the outcome of the testing. Nothing ventured nothing gained.

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Sometimes you write things that literally make me flash back to when I was first diagnosed.  I remember the first months, thinking "I can’t be mentally ill".  I bought societies image of mentally ill people – the image of people with hollow eyes, and a crazed look, often living on the streets because they couldn’t function as full members of society.  I wasn’t like that. Eventually, my mental image of "mentally ill" changed to encompass people who have managable conditions, who need to adapt their lifestyle to cope.  I think that you are thinking the same way about "disabled" as I was about "mentally ill". A lot of people need special adaptations to cope with life.  The most obvious ones are the blind and deaf.  But a lot of peple have disabilities that are subtler, and need a bit of help in order to be able to live full lives and contribute to society.   Do you read "For Better Or For Worse"? Yes, the comic strip.  This weeks series talked about a girl who needed help in school because she couldn’t recognize the written word – she had to tape everything and have a special assistant.  Should she simply have to give up school, because her disability is not common, and not visible? Of course not.  It isn’t good for her, and it isn’t good for society.  Even non-disabled people sometimes need special accommodations:  I have two co-workers who have had to take a lot of time off work, one because of problems with menopause and the other because of some mysterious heart ailment.  Another man – an important VP – had to take time off to deal with his wife who had cancer.  The owner had to take a lot of time to deal with premature twins.  All of these people required special accomodations, that we made willingly because it was the right thing to do. It’s better for society that you get the training you need to work, as much as you can.  If that means you need a little longer to take tests because of anxiety, then so be it.  The alternative is that they put you in a low level job that really doesn’t suit you, and you will end up more anxious and probably on permanent disability.  Some bp’ers can’t work, but most can, and I strontgly believe that if you have the chance you should work all you can. Work provides structure and emotional rewards and social stability, as well as financial stability. In short (I know, too late <g)… take whatever help you need to get the training you need.  It’s in your best interests, and societies best interests.  And remember – you have been gradually improving since you were diagnosed.  You may not notice it, but as one who has been communicating with you for a while, I can see it.  You’re sharper now than you were 3 months ago, and I’m betting that you will get sharper as you adapt to the limitations of being bipolar and being on meds.  Life isn’t static.  You may not always need the help.  But as long as you do, take it.  Don’t let bipolarity stop you from being all you can be. Diane

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am feeling restless and can’t think straight. I am in the middle of making a decision for going back to school. I want to become a Paralegal. Now here is the dilemma. I had some Aptitude tests and the result show that yes I work accurate but because of the time factor I didn’t finished to many questions. I blanked out and couldn’t even do a simple multiplication as 6 times 4. As time got shorter I started panicking more and more until I simply run out of time, therefore the test results are lousy. According to the tests result my English is like a grade 8 student and my math skills are even worse.  I don’t understand that and asked my instructor how I could have graduated from college as the best in my class with Scholar  if my English is that bad. He than said that one of the problems is my memory problem ( I had to read some paragraphs several time) and my continue checking over to make sure I did it right and of course the time factor worked in my disadvantage. He recommended and also people from my support group too to apply at the school for disability arrangements. I have a problem with that. I already have a very hard time to even accept and acknowledge that I am bipolar. Now am I supposed to go to the school assessment center and asked for special needs help e.g. longer time on tests…meaning openly admit that I am mentally ill. I am not disabled. I would like to know what you guys/girls think about that. I would appreciate any advice, experiences or opinion. thanks HappyPolarBear

Response:

When I was in college (graduated ‘98 so it’s recent) I was the VP of the Disabled Advocates group.  We made sure students had the allowances they needed for their individual problems.  There is nothing wrong with needing allowances to complete your studies.  You truly need them.  I agree with Lindy.  You need to learn to accept that you have bipolar.  You don’t need to identify yourself by it but it is a part of you.  It doesn’t make you less or more intelligent.  It doesn’t make you a criminal, unless you choose to be, and it isn’t your fault.  It’s a medical condition.  If you had limited vision would you not seek the help you need?  What you experience is not different. IMO take the help and then use you education to the best of your advantage. c

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I am feeling restless and can’t think straight. I am in the middle of making a decision for going back to school. I want to become a Paralegal. Now here is the dilemma. I had some Aptitude tests and the result show that yes I work accurate but because of the time factor I didn’t finished to many questions. I blanked out and couldn’t even do a simple multiplication as 6 times 4. As time got shorter I started panicking more and more until I simply run out of time, therefore the test results are lousy. According to the tests result my English is like a grade 8 student and my math skills are even worse.  I don’t understand that and asked my instructor how I could have graduated from college as the best in my class with Scholar  if my English is that bad. He than said that one of the problems is my memory problem ( I had to read some paragraphs several time) and my continue checking over to make sure I did it right and of course the time factor worked in my disadvantage. He recommended and also people from my support group too to apply at the school for disability arrangements. I have a problem with that. I already have a very hard time to even accept and acknowledge that I am bipolar. Now am I supposed to go to the school assessment center and asked for special needs help e.g. longer time on tests…meaning openly admit that I am mentally ill. I am not disabled. I would like to know what you guys/girls think about that. I would appreciate any advice, experiences or opinion. thanks HappyPolarBear

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I would ask for the help.  Until you own your condition you will never be able to deal with it…jmo.

Response:

He recommended and also people from my support group too to apply at the school for disability arrangements. I have a problem with that. I already have a very hard time to even accept and acknowledge that I am bipolar. Now am I supposed to go to the school assessment center and asked for special needs help e.g. longer time on tests…meaning openly admit that I am mentally ill. I am not disabled.

I don’t know what country you are in, but I do know that in the United States, even a learning disability like dyslexia requires that students have special needs, such as longer time on tests.  By law, they CAN NOT disclose what your "disability" is, and those records are kept confidential and locked away where only a select few can see them.   Basically, no one except for a couple of people will know you are mentally ill.  Everyone else will think that you have a learning disability, something rather common in the United States.

Response:

I am feeling restless and can’t think straight. I am in the middle of making a decision for going back to school. I want to become a Paralegal. Now here is the dilemma. I had some Aptitude tests and the result show that yes I work accurate but because of the time factor I didn’t finished to many questions. I blanked out and couldn’t even do a simple multiplication as 6 times 4. As time got shorter I started panicking more and more until I simply run out of time, therefore the test results are lousy. According to the tests result my English is like a grade 8 student and my math skills are even worse.  I don’t understand that and asked my instructor how I could have graduated from college as the best in my class with Scholar  if my English is that bad. He than said that one of the problems is my memory problem ( I had to read some paragraphs several time) and my continue checking over to make sure I did it right and of course the time factor worked in my disadvantage. He recommended and also people from my support group too to apply at the school for disability arrangements. I have a problem with that. I already have a very hard time to even accept and acknowledge that I am bipolar. Now am I supposed to go to the school assessment center and asked for special needs help e.g. longer time on tests…meaning openly admit that I am mentally ill. I am not disabled. I would like to know what you guys/girls think about that. I would appreciate any advice, experiences or opinion. thanks HappyPolarBear

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Hi David, My son is also 10 and I have been asked if I would accept help from an Educational Psychologist to assess him as they think he maybe Dyslexic as he has the reading and writing age of a 6 year old. So I would like to know my rights on education and what they should offer to him as extra curricular. I often wonder if they had had him in school earlier if they would of picked up on it sooner rather than later. He was born 09.09.1994 but because the school year started on 06.09 they did not allow him to go to school until the following year by that time he was 3 days away from being 6 and almost a year older than the rest of the class. Any info would be gratefully appreciated. Regards Jackie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Can anyone help me? My son has been diagnosed by an ed psych with dyslexia originally 3 years go and again in july 2004.  He is 10 years old and now in year 6 of his primary school. we feel the school is doing very little to help him and each time we ask what is being done we are told they are going to have a meeting to decide.  By the time they decide what should be done he will be leaving primary school and going to high school! we are exasperated and need to know exactly what measures the school should be putting in place to help and support him. thanks david

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Can anyone help me? My son has been diagnosed by an ed psych with dyslexia originally 3 years go and again in july 2004.  He is 10 years old and now in year 6 of his primary school. we feel the school is doing very little to help him and each time we ask what is being done we are told they are going to have a meeting to decide.  By the time they decide what should be done he will be leaving primary school and going to high school! we are exasperated and need to know exactly what measures the school should be putting in place to help and support him. thanks david

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Can anyone help me? My son has been diagnosed by an ed psych with dyslexia originally 3 years go and again in july 2004.  He is 10 years old and now in year 6 of his primary school. we feel the school is doing very little to help him and each time we ask what is being done we are told they are going to have a meeting to decide.  By the time they decide what should be done he will be leaving primary school and going to high school! we are exasperated and need to know exactly what measures the school should be putting in place to help and support him. thanks david

okay so he has been satmented? he should of had recomdations of the ed psych, things such as coaching in spelling reading, which i had at his age, not being a parent i’m not really up on what schools do now adays, as things may have changed by now though looking at the adault ed i’m doing prob not that much. i do rember that i had a number of tests before they decied what to do, and then on a few other tests every so often. roger

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Where are you in the country ? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Can anyone help me? My son has been diagnosed by an ed psych with dyslexia originally 3 years go and again in july 2004.  He is 10 years old and now in year 6 of his primary school. we feel the school is doing very little to help him and each time we ask what is being done we are told they are going to have a meeting to decide.  By the time they decide what should be done he will be leaving primary school and going to high school! we are exasperated and need to know exactly what measures the school should be putting in place to help and support him. thanks david

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Hi Jackie, There is a lot of information on www.beingdyslexic.co.uk as to what you should do once your child has been diagnosed with dyslexia. Try the infromation at the top of the page, then ‘Parents & Gaurdians’ Hope that helps

not a bad site you have there sam. the site linked off it confusing words is quite fun and possibly useful, roger

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Hi Jackie, There is a lot of information on www.beingdyslexic.co.uk as to what you should do once your child has been diagnosed with dyslexia. Try the infromation at the top of the page, then ‘Parents & Gaurdians’ Hope that helps – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi David, My son is also 10 and I have been asked if I would accept help from an Educational Psychologist to assess him as they think he maybe Dyslexic as he has the reading and writing age of a 6 year old. So I would like to know my rights on education and what they should offer to him as extra curricular. I often wonder if they had had him in school earlier if they would of picked up on it sooner rather than later. He was born 09.09.1994 but because the school year started on 06.09 they did not allow him to go to school until the following year by that time he was 3 days away from being 6 and almost a year older than the rest of the class. Any info would be gratefully appreciated. Regards Jackie Can anyone help me? My son has been diagnosed by an ed psych with dyslexia originally 3 years go and again in july 2004.  He is 10 years old and now in year 6 of his primary school. we feel the school is doing very little to help him and each time we ask what is being done we are told they are going to have a meeting to decide.  By the time they decide what should be done he will be leaving primary school and going to high school! we are exasperated and need to know exactly what measures the school should be putting in place to help and support him. thanks david

Response:

Can anyone help me? My son has been diagnosed by an ed psych with dyslexia originally 3 years go and again in july 2004.  He is 10 years old and now in year 6 of his primary school. we feel the school is doing very little to help him and each time we ask what is being done we are told they are going to have a meeting to decide.  By the time they decide what should be done he will be leaving primary school and going to high school! we are exasperated and need to know exactly what measures the school should be putting in place to help and support him. thanks david

One of my kids was diagnosed just before the summer break. That would be about May or June. He had a few tests, and we had a few interviews. Since he returned to school in September, he has been straight into a special lesson each day, in addition to extra reading that the school had implimented for him about year 3. He has an appointment with the OT. It all happened very quickly for him. One point I should add is that we made a fuss about the data protection act. The school couldn’t discuss the lads problem with the OT who couldn’t discuss it with the special reading teacher, who couldn’t discuss it with the school psychologist. So we made it clear that we had no objection to these people sharing information about our son. It may have help speed things up and it could have been the school who have a very good record of spotting and getting help for pupils with special needs. Oh ….. we are in Northern Ireland max.it

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Hi All, I would welcome some pointers to online links were can get advice help and maybe good examples of web page design for the Dyslexic. I am part of a team of developers currently working on a very large site. We are trying to ensure a high degree of accessability for visually impaired/dyslexic users. We have good experience with visually impaired aids, but dyslexia ia a new one to us. Thank. Chris

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Hi Chris, I have a dutch link about dyslexia as well, maybe you can look here. There is one problem it’s a dutch site, but if you want to know more about my help or about the site you can always ask me. My site is http://home.hetnet.nl/~liesbest Liesbeth – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All, I would welcome some pointers to online links were can get advice help and maybe good examples of web page design for the Dyslexic. I am part of a team of developers currently working on a very large site. We are trying to ensure a high degree of accessability for visually impaired/dyslexic users. We have good experience with visually impaired aids, but dyslexia ia a new one to us. Thank. Chris

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Hi All, I would welcome some pointers to online links were can get advice help and maybe good examples of web page design for the Dyslexic. I am part of a team of developers currently working on a very large site. We are trying to ensure a high degree of accessability for visually impaired/dyslexic users. We have good experience with visually impaired aids, but dyslexia ia a new one to us. Thank. Chris

Make it very simple !  No flashy fonts ! There is a site out there – can’t remember the link – where we can change the colour of the font and/or background with the click of a button/drop down menu. Also see http://groups.google.co.uk/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&threadm=f673d600… which I’m sure will wrap so you’ll have to copy and past to get it all… As you’ll see, it’s a well discussed topic on the ng… The best thing to do is to design it and point us at the URL and ask us to make critical comments ! If you know Dyslexics, you’ll know that we tell the truth — Nick in Northallerton www.whelan.me.uk Also nickw7coc on Yahoo Messenger & on MSN Messenger & www.skype.com !

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  Greetings, I have been lurking here for awhile and have a question. I am trying to learn more about dyslexia and particularly trying to gain an understanding about dyslexia and art. I’m having some problems with what I am reading. For instance, I’ve read that dyslexics are good at art , but not good at drawing. Also, that they are visual, spatial, and think in pictures. Well, one could say that both Andrew Wyeth and Picasso are good at art, are visual, spatial, and think in pictures. Wyeth presents a fixed viewpoint perspective even though he often distorts  perspective for his own artistic expression. Picasso most often presents the idea that since the canvas is flat, any representation of perspective would be false, nothing more than visual trickery . Yet, art elements presented by Picasso can create a dynamic artistic space that is unique and particular to each painting. Basically, my question involves trying to understand if there are clear indications as to whether dyslexics lean toward Wyeth or Picasso?  Have any of you been involved in any research or study that concerns my question? Can any of you point me toward a website that might help me concerning this matter? At this point, my understanding of dyslexia depends on settling this question. Let me tell you that I am an artist and retired art teacher. I would like to have you check out this web site. It concerns the developmental stages of children’s art. If you read it  you will see that my ultimate question is to find out if dyslexics are esssentially hapic or visual. http://www.deakin.edu.au/fac_edu/visarts/defining_childart.htm Thank you, Stewart Schooley

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  Greetings, I have been lurking here for awhile and have a question. I am trying to learn more about dyslexia and particularly trying to gain an understanding about dyslexia and art. I’m having some problems with what I am reading. For instance, I’ve read that dyslexics are good at art , but not good at drawing. Also, that they are visual, spatial, and think in pictures.

that is the sterotype yes. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well, one could say that both Andrew Wyeth and Picasso are good at art, are visual, spatial, and think in pictures. Wyeth presents a fixed viewpoint perspective even though he often distorts  perspective for his own artistic expression. Picasso most often presents the idea that since the canvas is flat, any representation of perspective would be false, nothing more than visual trickery . Yet, art elements presented by Picasso can create a dynamic artistic space that is unique and particular to each painting. Basically, my question involves trying to understand if there are clear indications as to whether dyslexics lean toward Wyeth or Picasso?  Have any of you been involved in any research or study that concerns my question? Can any of you point me toward a website that might help me concerning this matter? At this point, my understanding of dyslexia depends on settling this question.

i would suspect due to the fact that dyslexica is such a broad church that differnt dyslexics would lean on way or another, every dyslexics i’ve met you find while you have simulartives you also have quite wide differnaces as well to the way your mind works. Let me tell you that I am an artist and retired art teacher. I would like to have you check out this web site. It concerns the developmental stages of children’s art. If you read it  you will see that my ultimate question is to find out if dyslexics are esssentially hapic or visual. http://www.deakin.edu.au/fac_edu/visarts/defining_childart.htm Thank you, Stewart Schooley

Roger and out — usr is wodger

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Sorry this came so late but I just found this group page  Any way I had the same encounter as you with the ignorant teacher I signup for and art and design class at the local college I was 22 at the time and I also informed the teacher about my dyslexia she now nothing about dyslexia but I thoat I wood be open to any of her questions and may be it wood you no teach the teacher but I was sadly mistaking it turns out she couldn’t be bothered with the mentally handicap as she pout it but I mite have a problem with reading and writing and most of all memory but I wood not call my self mentally handicaps you see sins I was a child I was good at art and hen I am drawing or painting I go in to my on little world I imagine with your music the same thing happens so I when to this class hoping to improve my talents but in the class the art was not the problem it was the writing part you needed writing work to back up your art work and as you all now my writing is not perfect but I really triad so I did all the art first and tried to do the writing work after she did not like that so she said catch  up are maybe you are not cut out  for this class but I triad to fro a death ear and ignore that comment but I could not do it you see at that point a self confidents was low and it dus not help when the teacher telling you that she has not time for people like me and at one point it got to much she never mad it easy for me and I give up hath way fro the course and now I am 23 I still now I gave up a moment of a life time but they are people out there fear what they don’t under stand and i pity them i have a lot of talent in me it is a shaem thay don’t see that.

    First off, it’s insulting that she referred to dyslexia as a mental handicap. Secondly, it doesn’t matter whether or not she has the time. Under the ADA and as a requirement for state and federal funding she is required to make the time. It’s part of her job. At the very least she should’ve directed you to the disabilities office where they would’ve found ways to help you compensate for dyslexia. And they’re usually willing to do anything from just reviewing your papers for grammer all the way to sitting in class and taking your notes for you and writing your papers as you dictate. And it isn’t a privelage to go to a public college. You’re paying money to go there. That entitles you to some things. Your instructers are being paid to work there, it’s their privelage.     If I were you, I’d go and bitch to the dean about what happens. You’ll give the school another reason not to rehire this teacher for the next semester, and you should be able to get your tuition payment refunded too. It might be a little bit too late for that now, but it doesn’t hurt to try. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – PS. sorry about spelling I pout fro spell checker a couple of time I hope I got that spelling fixed.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –                hi all  dyslexia does hold you back why well i statred a course in sound and audio at a collage near me in london .. when i started i told them about my dyslexia thought it was only best, started they course 3 weeks in to they course i told my teacher about my dyslexia just so he thought i was trying … rather than him saying ok i take on bored wot u say about your dyslexia …i got they reply well its probley best you dont do this course …i thought about it didnt really like wot he just said to me .thas just one instance of something like that happning to me … i read in a local dyslexia group email that i get that 80% of young offenders have dyslexia   thas shocking,  when i look at it really if you cant fill they form to get they job or what ever your going for in they first place you arent going to be going very far ….. i think when it comes to jobs and that dyslexia will hold u back …… maybe depending how  bad ur dyslexia is . theres also still they great social  stigma about it … in my experance its been more bad than good …… i just hope one day that nuro scince will come up with something that cures it out … most of they pepole i have met with dyslexia …have been very long term unenployed ….they like me think wot good is this dysleixa  when u cant do wot most other people can do ie mathes english all that jass ..etc   ..anyhow that my bit on why dyslexia holds you back .. later buy for now   ambient www.ambientboy.co.uk

i don’t know your exact details but from what you’ve said and looking at your website you have a love of music, i don’t know what areas you would find diffucult as disexica is such a broad church, but with motivation you can over come hurdles, it might be diffuicult but not impossible. the chances are very high that the teacher is not a expert in dyslexica, so i would take his advice and put it where it desirves to go the problem with dyslexica is one its just a catch all fraze and secondly people even people who should do often don’t attually have any apreationation of what it means. i susgest you take a vistit to the suport staff at the college and get help, if you haven’t been stamented that needs to be done, this is also so the tutors have to offically take into considration spelling grammer etc, also if you don’t have a laptop i’ve found they seem quite keen on giving them out lol! roger and out — usr is wodger

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               hi all  dyslexia does hold you back why well i statred a course in sound and audio at a collage near me in london .. when i started i told them about my dyslexia thought it was only best, started they course 3 weeks in to they course i told my teacher about my dyslexia just so he thought i was trying … rather than him saying ok i take on bored wot u say about your dyslexia …i got they reply well its probley best you dont do this course …i thought about it didnt really like wot he just said to me .thas just one instance of something like that happning to me … i read in a local dyslexia group email that i get that 80% of young offenders have dyslexia   thas shocking,  when i look at it really if you cant fill they form to get they job or what ever your going for in they first place you arent going to be going very far ….. i think when it comes to jobs and that dyslexia will hold u back …… maybe depending how  bad ur dyslexia is . theres also still they great social  stigma about it … in my experance its been more bad than good …… i just hope one day that nuro scince will come up with something that cures it out … most of they pepole i have met with dyslexia …have been very long term unenployed ….they like me think wot good is this dysleixa  when u cant do wot most other people can do ie mathes english all that jass ..etc   ..anyhow that my bit on why dyslexia holds you back .. later buy for now   ambient www.ambientboy.co.uk

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Hi Sorry this came so late but I just found this group page  Any way I had the same encounter as you with the ignorant teacher I signup for and art and design class at the local college I was 22 at the time and I also informed the teacher about my dyslexia she now nothing about dyslexia but I thoat I wood be open to any of her questions and may be it wood you no teach the teacher but I was sadly mistaking it turns out she couldn’t be bothered with the mentally handicap as she pout it but I mite have a problem with reading and writing and most of all memory but I wood not call my self mentally handicaps you see sins I was a child I was good at art and hen I am drawing or painting I go in to my on little world I imagine with your music the same thing happens so I when to this class hoping to improve my talents but in the class the art was not the problem it was the writing part you needed writing work to back up your art work and as you all now my writing is not perfect but I really triad so I did all the art first and tried to do the writing work after she did not like that so she said catch  up are maybe you are not cut out  for this class but I triad to fro a death ear and ignore that comment but I could not do it you see at that point a self confidents was low and it dus not help when the teacher telling you that she has not time for people like me and at one point it got to much she never mad it easy for me and I give up hath way fro the course and now I am 23 I still now I gave up a moment of a life time but they are people out there fear what they don’t under stand and i pity them i have a lot of talent in me it is a shaem thay don’t see that. PS. sorry about spelling I pout fro spell checker a couple of time I hope I got that spelling fixed.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m really sorry to hear about the ruff time you’ve had dealing with people concerning your dyslexia.  That teacher was very ignorant.  Not enough people know and understand what dyslexia is all about.  You may have trouble with the language part of academics but you are probably very gifted in other areas.  Sound and audio sounds like a very good field for someone with dyslexia.  I really hope that you didn’t drop the course and that you found some help to get through the ruff spots.  You can’t let ignorance stand in your way or the dyslexia will hold you back.  It all comes down to you believing in yourself!  You may have to fight harder but you know what they say, "what doesn’t kill us makes us stronger".  Aren’t you worth it? My husband and son have dyslexia.  My husband went through public school (dropped out in grade and ended up working in a textile factory.  He had a low opinion of himself also.  I saw all of the special gifts he had inside and encouraged him to follow his dream.  His passion was heavy machinery. He went to a truckers school (one of the best in the world), he didn’t let anyone tell him that he wasn’t able or maybe he shouldn’t be there, let them put up with all of the spelling mistakes (he wasn’t there for spelling but to learn how to drive a rig) and passed with the highest grades of the class.  He’s now driving a rig and transporting heavy machinery.  He makes a good salary and by doing all of this, his self esteem is way up there. Life is all a choice.  Make the right one.  Yes, a lot of dyslexics are delinquents or in jail.  That’s the easy way out.  It’s not the dyslexia holding them back.  There are a lot of very good jobs out there where dyslexics can excel.  Look at Bill Gates from Microsoft.  He has dyslexia and it didn’t stop him.   It didn’t stop my husband, my brother, and it won’t stop my son.  Geez, he’s 7 years old and can already drive most of the heavy machinery and trucks very well (a lot better than me).  He has the same special gift as his father.  An excellent eye hand coordination.  He may not become a poet, lawyer or professor in a university but he could become a trucker, teacher, fireman, policeman, construction, pilot and the list goes on.

* Hi! The new mayor of San Francisco, Gavin Newsome, is dyslexic.  He is a terrific guy who has surprised many of us.  He has received nothing but praise from both his supporters and those who supported his opponent in the last election. He should stand as a great example for all dyslexic people. earle * —               __            __/_           /_/_/           /_/_     earle              /_/     jones

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Hi Neil When I was at school, I always wanted to work with computers and electronics. Always pulling things apart to see how they work, sometimes to see if I could make them myself I was always in the remedial classes all through school, and was told one that if I wanted to do electronics and computers that I would need to know physics and math’s. Because I was in the remedial class they said it will be no point in me trying to do those subjects as I don’t have the math’s skills. For me being in being in the remedial classes was like someone that spoke English living with people that spoke other languages and the teachers and the world were speaking broken English. I knew deep down I did not belong to that group, but found it very hard fitting into the world. I have to find my own route to do the things that I wanted to do. I think that God has blessed me with a strong will ) So I never gave up my quest to do what I wanted to do, my dermas as a child To day I work for AT&T as a network Technician, working with computers and network equipment. I use to deal with multinationals and their data networks across the world, I am now based on one of our customers site doing all of their UK and world wide links support. What am I saying, if you have a dream, don’t let anyone kill that dream or stop you, examine all avenues that are available to you to peruse that dream. Maybe you may not be able to live your dream, but think of all the things that you will learn and pickup along the way Hope this helps someone Regards Leslie…UK:-) PS. Message to parents, don’t give up on your son and daughter just because they are not doing things the way they you think that they should be doing it. Or the way that other kids are doing it, help they to find the way that is best for them. That the feel comfortable and relaxed with – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Sorry this came so late but I just found this group page  Any way I had the same encounter as you with the ignorant teacher I signup for and art and design class at the local college I was 22 at the time and I also informed the teacher about my dyslexia she now nothing about dyslexia but I thoat I wood be open to any of her questions and may be it wood you no teach the teacher but I was sadly mistaking it turns out she couldn’t be bothered with the mentally handicap as she pout it but I mite have a problem with reading and writing and most of all memory but I wood not call my self mentally handicaps you see sins I was a child I was good at art and hen I am drawing or painting I go in to my on little world I imagine with your music the same thing happens so I when to this class hoping to improve my talents but in the class the art was not the problem it was the writing part you needed writing work to back up your art work and as you all now my writing is not perfect but I really triad so I did all the art first and tried to do the writing work after she did not like that so she said catch  up are maybe you are not cut out  for this class but I triad to fro a death ear and ignore that comment but I could not do it you see at that point a self confidents was low and it dus not help when the teacher telling you that she has not time for people like me and at one point it got to much she never mad it easy for me and I give up hath way fro the course and now I am 23 I still now I gave up a moment of a life time but they are people out there fear what they don’t under stand and i pity them i have a lot of talent in me it is a shaem thay don’t see that. PS. sorry about spelling I pout fro spell checker a couple of time I hope I got that spelling fixed.

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I’m really sorry to hear about the ruff time you’ve had dealing with people concerning your dyslexia.  That teacher was very ignorant.  Not enough people know and understand what dyslexia is all about.  You may have trouble with the language part of academics but you are probably very gifted in other areas.  Sound and audio sounds like a very good field for someone with dyslexia.  I really hope that you didn’t drop the course and that you found some help to get through the ruff spots.  You can’t let ignorance stand in your way or the dyslexia will hold you back.  It all comes down to you believing in yourself!  You may have to fight harder but you know what they say, "what doesn’t kill us makes us stronger".  Aren’t you worth it? My husband and son have dyslexia.  My husband went through public school (dropped out in grade and ended up working in a textile factory.  He had a low opinion of himself also.  I saw all of the special gifts he had inside and encouraged him to follow his dream.  His passion was heavy machinery. He went to a truckers school (one of the best in the world), he didn’t let anyone tell him that he wasn’t able or maybe he shouldn’t be there, let them put up with all of the spelling mistakes (he wasn’t there for spelling but to learn how to drive a rig) and passed with the highest grades of the class.  He’s now driving a rig and transporting heavy machinery.  He makes a good salary and by doing all of this, his self esteem is way up there. Life is all a choice.  Make the right one.  Yes, a lot of dyslexics are delinquents or in jail.  That’s the easy way out.  It’s not the dyslexia holding them back.  There are a lot of very good jobs out there where dyslexics can excel.  Look at Bill Gates from Microsoft.  He has dyslexia and it didn’t stop him.   It didn’t stop my husband, my brother, and it won’t stop my son.  Geez, he’s 7 years old and can already drive most of the heavy machinery and trucks very well (a lot better than me).  He has the same special gift as his father.  An excellent eye hand coordination.  He may not become a poet, lawyer or professor in a university but he could become a trucker, teacher, fireman, policeman, construction, pilot and the list goes on.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –                hi all  dyslexia does hold you back why well i statred a course in sound and audio at a collage near me in london .. when i started i told them about my dyslexia thought it was only best, started they course 3 weeks in to they course i told my teacher about my dyslexia just so he thought i was trying … rather than him saying ok i take on bored wot u say about your dyslexia …i got they reply well its probley best you dont do this course …i thought about it didnt really like wot he just said to me .thas just one instance of something like that happning to me … i read in a local dyslexia group email that i get that 80% of young offenders have dyslexia   thas shocking,  when i look at it really if you cant fill they form to get they job or what ever your going for in they first place you arent going to be going very far ….. i think when it comes to jobs and that dyslexia will hold u back …… maybe depending how  bad ur dyslexia is . theres also still they great social  stigma about it … in my experance its been more bad than good …… i just hope one day that nuro scince will come up with something that cures it out … most of they pepole i have met with dyslexia …have been very long term unenployed ….they like me think wot good is this dysleixa  when u cant do wot most other people can do ie mathes english all that jass ..etc   ..anyhow that my bit on why dyslexia holds you back .. later buy for now   ambient www.ambientboy.co.uk

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On Tue, 25 May 2004 , In message What, in ordinary life, is she unable to do as a result of colour blindness?

Agree with me that what she called her green coat was in fact mustard coloured? — ^Thunder^ –

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People with minor ailments like that who throw their legs in the air screaming "don’t be nasty to me I’m disabled" are pathetic, parasitic losers who deserve to be treated with contempt. Maybe, but that does not mean that they are not disabled. "Minor ailments" < "disability"

THat’s my point.  Sometimes "Minor ailments" = disability, if only in paperwork and not in the mind of the, er, afflicted. Let’s talk about thumbs if you want to get to the nitty gritty. How much thumb would someone have to lose before you’d count them as disabled? What happens if they have a whole thumb but little use of it?

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On Tue, 25 May 2004 , In message On Tue, 25 May 2004 , In message What, in ordinary life, is she unable to do as a result of colour blindness? Agree with me that what she called her green coat was in fact mustard coloured? <grin  What colour was it?

Yellow Funnily enough on that subject, I understand that generally colour blindness is passed through the male line. Her father was completely colour blind but she just had problems with certain colours. Led to interesting rows when we were discussing for instance what paint to buy when we were re-decorating. She once brought home these colour blind test charts where, for instance, a colour blind person saw different images to those not colour blind – by squinting my eyes I _could_ see how she could mistake a certain row of dots for a different image (but then on one of my school reports my art master had said that I had a sense of colour well above the average) — ^Thunder^ –

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I bet you do not know what dyslexia is. If you’re unsure, then Google is your friend.

I know.  UK national expert, Dr McLaughlin told me, and I have checked his facts.  You may see David McLaughlin Ph.D. on TV in big cases. DYOR.

To find a site that knows less than I, and gets it wrong?  The top unpaid site heads with "The Gift of Dyslexia" – Dyslexia’s not an advantage for God’s bloody sake.  That’s a lie. It is notable however, how few of the sites use the phrase "disability" to describe the condition.

I’m not surprised.  What is a disappointment, however, typical of the British if not mankind, is the proportion of people who make pronouncements about things like dyslexia, without knowing what they are.  UK psychiatrists seem to be doing that with hyperactivity (does not, and never did, mean very active). As for your argument, you *have a case;* but the British make it worse.   When you start making minor neurological brain malfunctions, such as dyslexia, as common in females as males; or mental illness as common in men as women; as the British do, you devalue the meaning of these terms. You said some milk their dyslexia.  When the BBC’s blind correspondent, Peter White, asked blind listeners to say if they had ever "used" the fact that they are blind, the response was stupid question.  Be realistic – if people are disabled, the British are far too mean to make up for it. When you have noted that I say you have a case, may I again ask you to define Dyslexia? — http://www.tom-moore.com http://www.tom-moore.com/exten2/docs/ccf/index.html

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I again ask you to define Dyslexia?

Why you need my definition when there’s a perfectly good one at the Dyslexia Institute is beyond me, but since their site says "Dyslexia is now firmly established as a congenital and developmental condition. Its cause has not been fully confirmed but the effect is to create neurological anomalies in the brain. These anomalies bring about varying degrees of difficulty in learning when using words, and sometimes symbols." that’s good enough for me. Like I said, if you need more, go look it up. Their definition is good enough for me. But you’re missing the point. Dyslexia, irrespective of the vociferous nature of its supporters, or its legal status, is not by any sensible definition of the word, a disability. *That* is my point. Paul. — . A .sig is all well and good, but it’s no substitute for a personality . JMS: "SFX is a fairly useless publication on just about every imaginable front.   Never have so many jumped-up fanboys done so little, with so much, for so long." . EMail: Unless invited to, don’t. Your message is likely to be automatically deleted.

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Huh?  Who said dyslexia doesn’t exist? You’re starting to make it up now!

 You did, without knowing perhaps.  That’s what not pigeon-holing it means. Something like recognising there is a problem, but treating the person as an individual, rather than an illness.  Do that with cancer, and the patient dies. You should pigeon-hole dyslexia:  say what it is, (and what it is not – everything else). Now you say I cannot.  One web page I found has an accurate definition of dyslexia.  Took time, but I got there. Which has nothing whatsoever to do with pigeon-holing anything.

That’s exactly what pigeon-holing is:  setting its limits.  What’s really annoying about the definition you were given, is it is not pigeon-holed, and therefore includes just about every problem with learning. Presumably, these people think that when one stops learning, the dyslexia stops.  Of course not, but it follows from what they say. I suggest you lose the white heat of righteous indignation and calm down a bit. Your reasoning is slipping badly.

1.  righteous indignation – guilty. 2.  calm down – no need. If you ever do get through the BS, and understand what dyslexia really is, it is unlikely to alter your conclusion, which I think is roughly that "dyslexia cannot, of itself, be called a disability, without devaluing the term disability." — http://www.tom-moore.com http://www.tom-moore.com/exten2/docs/ccf

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People with minor ailments like that who throw their legs in the air screaming "don’t be nasty to me I’m disabled" are pathetic, parasitic losers who deserve to be treated with contempt.

Maybe, but that does not mean that they are not disabled.

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It is notable however, how few of the sites use the phrase "disability" to describe the condition. Your point would be?

He might be desperate – his post gives me that impression – but I am not.   You may dispute, with Demetrius Zeluff and others, whether or not dyslexia is a disability, but I do not think your views are necessarily incompatible with his. In my opinion, since I was not asked, your view is a matter of taste, but it appears to me incomplete.  You have good grounds for dismissing dyslexia as no more of a disability than Tony Blair is a socialist, but is that all that needs to be said on the question of dyslexia and disability? I promise you it is not. — http://www.tom-moore.com http://www.tom-moore.com/exten2/docs/ccf

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On Tue, 25 May 2004 , In message Dyslexia, irrespective of the vociferous nature of its supporters, or its legal status, is not by any sensible definition of the word, a disability. *That* is my point. Paul.

My (ex) wife was (still is) colour blind. I don’t think she ever considers she has a disability although being pedantic I suppose a strict definition of disability is the lack of an ability to do something (whether it is to read words or see colours) as others see them. — ^Thunder^ –

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Demetrius Zeluff  said We all lack the ability to do something. I can’t skateboard, for example. What, in ordinary life, is she unable to do as a result of colour blindness? Get employment in the Electronics industry?

That’s exactly what my husband wished to when he left school, and couldn’t, bing colourblind.  Passed the interview, but failed that test. It certainly affected his life, as he took a somewhat boring office job, till he eventually realised what he’d like to do instead. But the real difference is, he can’t learn to tell red from green, Paul could learn to skateboard.  Badly perhaps. —  kat    ^..^<

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People with minor ailments like that who throw their legs in the air screaming "don’t be nasty to me I’m disabled" are pathetic, parasitic losers who deserve to be treated with contempt. Maybe, but that does not mean that they are not disabled.

"Minor ailments" < "disability" Paul. — . A .sig is all well and good, but it’s no substitute for a personality . JMS: "SFX is a fairly useless publication on just about every imaginable front.   Never have so many jumped-up fanboys done so little, with so much, for so long." . EMail: Unless invited to, don’t. Your message is likely to be automatically deleted.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It is notable however, how few of the sites use the phrase "disability" to describe the condition. Your point would be? He might be desperate – his post gives me that impression – but I am not.   You may dispute, with Demetrius Zeluff and others, whether or not dyslexia is a disability, but I do not think your views are necessarily incompatible with his. In my opinion, since I was not asked, your view is a matter of taste, but it appears to me incomplete.  You have good grounds for dismissing dyslexia as no more of a disability than Tony Blair is a socialist, but is that all that needs to be said on the question of dyslexia and disability? I promise you it is not.

Nobody, including me, is advocating censoring anything. Paul. — . A .sig is all well and good, but it’s no substitute for a personality . JMS: "SFX is a fairly useless publication on just about every imaginable front.   Never have so many jumped-up fanboys done so little, with so much, for so long." . EMail: Unless invited to, don’t. Your message is likely to be automatically deleted.

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On Tue, 25 May 2004 , In message What, in ordinary life, is she unable to do as a result of colour blindness? Agree with me that what she called her green coat was in fact mustard coloured?

<grin  What colour was it? Paul. — . A .sig is all well and good, but it’s no substitute for a personality . JMS: "SFX is a fairly useless publication on just about every imaginable front.   Never have so many jumped-up fanboys done so little, with so much, for so long." . EMail: Unless invited to, don’t. Your message is likely to be automatically deleted.

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That many people hate the word disabled. It doesn’t stop it being used inaccurately as a feeble attempt at winning a lost argument either. You do not have a case for saying, as you have, that dyslexia does not mean a lack of ability.  You may think describing dyslexia as a disability is unhelpful – and for that, as I have said, you have a case – but you have none for saying it does not exist.

Huh?  Who said dyslexia doesn’t exist?  You’re starting to make it up now! What word would you use to pigeon hole dyslexia; ’syndrome’, ‘illness’, ‘condition’, ‘retardation’, ? Don’t recall pigeon-holing it anywhere. You told me I could find a definition from Google.

Yes. That does not mean a single word definition, which is what you were asking for above. Again, you’re making it up. Quite the opposite, in fact. Now you say I cannot.  One web page I found has an accurate definition of dyslexia.  Took time, but I got there.

Which has nothing whatsoever to do with pigeon-holing anything. I suggest you lose the white heat of righteous indignation and calm down a bit. Your reasoning is slipping badly. Paul. — . A .sig is all well and good, but it’s no substitute for a personality . JMS: "SFX is a fairly useless publication on just about every imaginable front.   Never have so many jumped-up fanboys done so little, with so much, for so long." . EMail: Unless invited to, don’t. Your message is likely to be automatically deleted.

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That many people hate the word disabled. It doesn’t stop it being used inaccurately as a feeble attempt at winning a lost argument either.

You do not have a case for saying, as you have, that dyslexia does not mean a lack of ability.  You may think describing dyslexia as a disability is unhelpful – and for that, as I have said, you have a case – but you have none for saying it does not exist. What word would you use to pigeon hole dyslexia; ’syndrome’, ‘illness’, ‘condition’, ‘retardation’, ? Don’t recall pigeon-holing it anywhere.

You told me I could find a definition from Google. Quite the opposite, in fact.

Now you say I cannot.  One web page I found has an accurate definition of dyslexia.  Took time, but I got there. — http://www.tom-moore.com http://www.tom-moore.com/exten2/docs/ccf

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Demetrius Zeluff  said We all lack the ability to do something. I can’t skateboard, for example. What, in ordinary life, is she unable to do as a result of colour blindness? Get employment in the Electronics industry? That’s exactly what my husband wished to when he left school, and couldn’t, bing colourblind.  Passed the interview, but failed that test. It certainly affected his life, as he took a somewhat boring office job, till he eventually realised what he’d like to do instead.

Curiously; I did get a job in electronics and *desperately* want to get out of it, into a boring office job.  Perhaps I should start applying, eh? My last employers were so clueless that they never thought to ask people if they were colour blind, and the ‘resistor tests’ were all faked, so there were a few colourblind people working there. Everything had a five digit part number.  There were two stores people; one was colourblind, the other was dyslexic. I can feel an alt.sysadmin style rant coming on. But the real difference is, he can’t learn to tell red from green, Paul could learn to skateboard.  Badly perhaps.

This colourblind stores chap had a good guess rate; about 85% accurate, which made him better than most of the shop floor.

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I again ask you to define Dyslexia? Why you need my definition

I’m sure you’re aware that Tom Moore is a fuck headed nong and that nothing useful can be gained from a conversation with him.

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My (ex) wife was (still is) colour blind. I don’t think she ever considers she has a disability although being pedantic I suppose a strict definition of disability is the lack of an ability to do something (whether it is to read words or see colours) as others see them.

We all lack the ability to do something. I can’t skateboard, for example. What, in ordinary life, is she unable to do as a result of colour blindness? It’s a question of degree. Dyslexic people have reasoning, memory and reading/comprehension difficulties. Partially deaf people (like me) have difficulty hearing and comprehending. Partially sighted people have difficulty seeing, especially at low light levels. And so on. None of the above are disabled. With a willingness to do something about it and a little help people like that/us lead normal, or very close to normal lives. People with minor ailments like that who throw their legs in the air screaming "don’t be nasty to me I’m disabled" are pathetic, parasitic losers who deserve to be treated with contempt. Paul. — . A .sig is all well and good, but it’s no substitute for a personality . JMS: "SFX is a fairly useless publication on just about every imaginable front.   Never have so many jumped-up fanboys done so little, with so much, for so long." . EMail: Unless invited to, don’t. Your message is likely to be automatically deleted.

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Demetrius Zeluff  said Get employment in the Electronics industry? That’s exactly what my husband wished to when he left school, and couldn’t, bing colourblind.  Passed the interview, but failed that test. It certainly affected his life, as he took a somewhat boring office job, till he eventually realised what he’d like to do instead. Curiously; I did get a job in electronics and *desperately* want to get out of it, into a boring office job.  Perhaps I should start applying, eh?

It’s a long time since he had that, he became a computer operator and now he’s an IT contractor who, if he had his time again, reckons he’d choose to be a plumber. My last employers were so clueless that they never thought to ask people if they were colour blind, and the ‘resistor tests’ were all faked, so there were a few colourblind people working there. Everything had a five digit part number.  There were two stores people; one was colourblind, the other was dyslexic. I can feel an alt.sysadmin style rant coming on. But the real difference is, he can’t learn to tell red from green, Paul could learn to skateboard.  Badly perhaps. This colourblind stores chap had a good guess rate; about 85% accurate, which made him better than most of the shop floor.

Stores is one thing, my husband wanted to be an engineer. —  kat    ^..^<

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Your point would be? That many people hate the word disabled.

Yes, especially government, especially British governments.  Disability means they have an obligation to spend money to help the disabled. One way to get around this is to ignore it, or pretend it does not exist, like the British and hyperactivity (something UK medical scientists never said). Another, like the British and mental illness, is to exaggerate its occurrence, so that 1:4 of the UK population are supposed to be mentally ill.  That way we simply cannot afford to pay for the treatment of 15 million people, can we? What word would you use to pigeon hole dyslexia; ’syndrome’, ‘illness’, ‘condition’, ‘retardation’, ?

Syndrome is worse, although the term means the degree to which it places its dis-at-ease varies.  Syndrome kind of sounds like doesn’t really exist, or is an excuse, but most diseases are syndromes. I would prefer to identify the cause of your dyslexia, and call it that. — http://www.tom-moore.com http://www.tom-moore.com/exten2/docs/ccf

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If you look up "disability" in, for example, Merriam Websters dictionary, you’ll find, under the sub-reference marked "learning disability"  the following "any of various conditions (as dyslexia) that interfere with an individual’s ability to learn and so result in impaired functioning in language, reasoning, or academic skills and that are thought to be caused by difficulties in processing and integrating information"

Someone thinks a "learning disability" needs to be defined, beyond something like a disablement of learning function?  Learning Disability is IQ < 70. "Something that hinders or incapacitates"

Indeed, but as Paul Harper will doubtless remind us, a long bus journey to school, hinders learning:  you don’t call that a disability, although in the strict sense, I suppose it is. So it seems that there *are* plenty of sensible definitions of the word "disability" that encompass dyslexia

There are, I agree, but I don’t see a sensible definition of dyslexia.  All we’ve been told is that it is difficulties learning when using words and/or difficulties learning when using symbols.  I suppose difficulties leaning with music is excluded, but it does seem to include a lot. Use those definitions, and Paul is right:  it does not set us apart. — http://www.tom-moore.com http://www.tom-moore.com/exten2/docs/ccf

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My (ex) wife was (still is) colour blind. I don’t think she ever considers she has a disability although being pedantic I suppose a strict definition of disability is the lack of an ability to do something (whether it is to read words or see colours) as others see them. We all lack the ability to do something. I can’t skateboard, for example. What, in ordinary life, is she unable to do as a result of colour blindness?

Get employment in the Electronics industry?

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What word would you use to pigeon hole dyslexia; ’syndrome’, ‘illness’, ‘condition’, ‘retardation’, ? Syndrome is worse, although the term means the degree to which it places its dis-at-ease varies.  Syndrome kind of sounds like doesn’t really exist, or is an excuse, but most diseases are syndromes.

A disease is called a syndrome until its cause is found. Until then it’s just a collection of symptoms that may or may not have a common cause.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I again ask you to define Dyslexia? Why you need my definition when there’s a perfectly good one at the Dyslexia Institute is beyond me, but since their site says "Dyslexia is now firmly established as a congenital and developmental condition. Its cause has not been fully confirmed but the effect is to create neurological anomalies in the brain. These anomalies bring about varying degrees of difficulty in learning when using words, and sometimes symbols." that’s good enough for me. Like I said, if you need more, go look it up. Their definition is good enough for me. But you’re missing the point. Dyslexia, irrespective of the vociferous nature of its supporters, or its legal status, is not by any sensible definition of the word, a disability. *That* is my point.

If you look up "disability" in, for example, Merriam Websters dictionary, you’ll find, under the sub-reference marked "learning disability"  the following "any of various conditions (as dyslexia) that interfere with an individual’s ability to learn and so result in impaired functioning in language, reasoning, or academic skills and that are thought to be caused by difficulties in processing and integrating information" The Cambridge International Dictionary gives, under disability "an illness, injury or condition that makes it difficult for someone to do the things that other people do" which is almost identical to the terms used by the Dyslexia Institute The American Heritage  Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition defines "disability" as "disadvantage or deficiency, especially a physical or mental impairment that interferes with or prevents normal achievement in a particular area." "Something that hinders or incapacitates" both of which are entirely consistent with the definition of dyslexia you posted from the Dyslexia Institute etc etc etc So it seems that there *are* plenty of sensible definitions of the word "disability" that encompass dyslexia Brian

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Why you need my definition when there’s a perfectly good one at the Dyslexia Institute is beyond me, [ . . . ].

There are so many different, and so many wrong, understandings of dyslexia, like paranoia, hyperactivity and nervous breakdown, that one’s use of the term does convey to your audience the nature of the disorder to which you refer, when you say dyslexia.  Yet dyslexia, like paranoia, can be easily defined. [ One of the others is more difficult, but a definition is possible, the other does not exist. ] [ . . . ] "Dyslexia is now firmly established as a congenital and developmental condition.

That’s not what it is, that’s a proposition of its class, and wrong (or incomplete anyway). Its cause has not been fully confirmed but the effect is to create neurological anomalies in the brain.

That’s not what it is, that’s one its causes, although someone seems to be trying to tell that only "neurological anomalies in the brain" lead to dyslexia.  That’s not true. These anomalies bring about varying degrees of difficulty in learning when using words, and sometimes symbols."

Dyslexia, you’ve been led to believe, is a difficulty in learning when using words, and symbols? that’s good enough for me.

Well, you’re easily pleased then. Further, and importantly, if you believe that, then I do not see how any reasonable person could conclude much other than either (a) the definition supplied is unhelpful; or (b) dyslexia is not a disability. Another case of garbage in – garbage out.  In Einstein’s only source material was garbage, rather than Newton and Leibniz, his would have been much nearer to garbage. Like I said, if you need more, go look it up.

More bull shit?  More waffle?  No thank you. Dyslexia, irrespective of the vociferous nature of its supporters, or its legal status, is not by any sensible definition of the word, a disability. *That* is my point.

And if that’s your premise, your conclusion follows, and does so without a great deal of thought. — http://www.tom-moore.com http://www.tom-moore.com/exten2/docs/ccf

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Since childhood I am haveing great difficulties reading. Reading is slow and really annoying. (sometimes I wander away without reading anything) I have difficulty interpreting stuff I read. This includes really difficult, but also very simple texts. Reading a newspaper article is very difficult without wandering away. Listening to people talking is also difficult without wandering away. I think this is caused by ADD. That is why I take low doses of stimulant meds. But can these problems be attribuated to dyslexia?

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Since childhood I am haveing great difficulties reading. Reading is slow and really annoying. (sometimes I wander away without reading anything) I have difficulty interpreting stuff I read. This includes really difficult, but also very simple texts. Reading a newspaper article is very difficult without wandering away. Listening to people talking is also difficult without wandering away. I think this is caused by ADD. That is why I take low doses of stimulant meds. But can these problems be attribuated to dyslexia?

Short answer: yes. If something is nearly impossible for you, you will naturally avoid it – sometimes by tuning out. Proper psychoeducational testing should be able to tell the difference. It’s possible to have both, of course. -Janna — Autistic Spectrum Code v.1.0 AC! d- s+: a- c+ p+ t f S+ !p e+++++ h+++ r-++ n+ i P+++ m-++ M+++++ Another random thought from my random brain… Brought to you by the colour green, the number 7, and the letters J, L, and H. http://geocities.com/janna_louise Guinea pigs have ADD. "Nobody realizes that some people expend tremendous energy merely to be normal." – Albert Camus

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve missed you good folk and I’m sorry I haven’t been about. But this past week or so has sucked majestically. <snip Last night after having the job yanked from under my nose, the cats were all over me. They seem to know when Mama feels like hell. Brandy sat on me and purred like a little diesel engine. Stosh lay by my feet, and Roxie and Odessa kept coming to look in on me. I thank God for them. They’re not capable of the bullshit that human beings heap upon one another. Blessed be, Baha Three thousand years ago, cats were deified in ancient Egypt. To this day, they have not forgotten.

I’m so sorry to read about your problems. Sadly identity theft is getting more common. Purrs that your life gets better very soon. — Adrian (Owned by Snoopy & Bagheera) A house is not a home, without a cat.

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I’m so sorry to hear you had such a bad week. We are thinking of you, sending lots of purrs and hugs just for you, plus best wishes for things to start getting much better right away, — Polonca & Soncek

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve missed you good folk and I’m sorry I haven’t been about. But this past week or so has sucked majestically. We discovered last week that some filthbag had stolen our debit card numbers and started hosing both our accounts. It’s been a fiasco. <snip

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Sorry for not quoting. Of course you can rant. Having you card numbers stolen sux. As far as being fired due to disability. That is illegal! Under the American’s with Disability Act of 1990, they are obligated to accomodate you. Find out where your nearest Center For Independent Living they can make suggestions on what to do. Suz

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MOre inserted. — Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus      www.lds.org      www.mormons.com

I’ve missed you good folk and I’m sorry I haven’t been about. But this past week or so has sucked majestically. CY: Sorry to hear that. We discovered last week that some filthbag had stolen our debit card numbers and started hosing both our accounts. It’s been a fiasco. CY: I can imagine that makes life dificult. Can’t do much without money. We’ve had to shut down every scrap of plastic in the house, spend hours on the phone with the credit bureaus to flag us (because the money has been going to an overseas company that presses shady credit cards for any fool desperate enough to pay the activation fee) CY: Well, gee, spend someone else’s stolen money to get another card? Sounds like someething crooks would do. and with our banks, not to mention the local police and FBI. In short, my identity is floating around out there somewhere, CY: That’s no good. YOu feeling disembodied? and some five-hundred pound, unwashed man is calling himself Elizabeth and ordering foreign porn featuring teenagers. CY: You always were good with mental imaging. I am getting visions of the 500 pound man…. The cards will be replaced with new numbers, but that will take a bit of time, and for the moment just going to the store is a nightmare. We went to get groceries Saturday night and it took almost an hour to get approved to cash a check. I remember when you could write one right at the counter, no problem. Now? 17 forms of ID, a police check, character references from your great-aunt in Boise, a letter from your priest-rabbi-imam-highpriestessofDiana. CY: And a shoppers card? We ended up very late for Joycie’s birthday party (out of nursing home, responding very well to radiation, tumor shrunk, good news in all this mess.) CY: That sounds like progress, to me. Well, for Joycie that is. Sounds like you’re still deep in the mud. On top of this, my work has asked me to get an evaluation for what was thought to be dyslexia. I’d been having trouble following certain instructions, getting all bollixed up when I had to do a multistep task for a customer’s account. It’s not dyslexia. I’ve had ADHD all this time, and on top of it I’ve just learned that I have a learning disability known as cognitive memory dysfunction. The sympoms tend to overlap with those of dyslexia. CY: Wow, and it went undiagnosed all this time? The bank is ready to toss me out on my @r$e. I’ve been put on Strattera as a trial for the ADHD, but little can be done about the other stuff. I’ve just lost an opportunity to advance because of this damnable thing, which has been disclosed to the company, the schmucks. CY: Oh, those wonderful disclosure statements? I’m thinking of giving them a bill. Even with the insurance, my money would be beter spent on catnip for the babies and a nice, expensive lipstick for their hardworking mama. My psychiatrist is having kittens himself. My bipolar/OCD is a bastard to treat as it is, and throwing ADHD in the mix is a recipe for disaster. He and I are both concerned about me remaining employable. Now more than ever. CY: Wow, might have to figure otu something creative? Want some ideas? Last night after having the job yanked from under my nose, the cats were all over me. They seem to know when Mama feels like hell. Brandy sat on me and purred like a little diesel engine. Stosh lay by my feet, and Roxie and Odessa kept coming to look in on me. I thank God for them. They’re not capable of the bullshit that human beings heap upon one another. CY: KNow that feeling! Blessed be, Baha — Three thousand years ago, cats were deified in ancient Egypt. To this day, they have not forgotten.

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I go around with my bank on this one every so often.  I have an ATM card.  I do not have and do not want a debit card.  I do not need some schmuck screwing around in my checking account.  Even innocent (maybe) mistakes can be a royal PITA. Problem is, the banks want to go paperless. Some actually charge for using checks now. Their goal is, I believe, to phase out paper in the next 5 years. One of these days there will be no choice.

My parents want their checks back.  Their bank said they would charge them for getting the actual checks.  My dad raised h*** with them about that and he gets his checks.  He doesn’t have a computer so he could only take their word for it on what checks have cleared and what haven’t.  My bank doesn’t give me my checks back anymore and charges me $5 a copy; as a result I rarely write paper checks and do my banking and bill pay online.  But what is a person without a computer to do?!  Dad is 80 years old – he’s not about to figure out how to use a computer. Jill

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve missed you good folk and I’m sorry I haven’t been about. But this past week or so has sucked majestically. We discovered last week that some filthbag had stolen our debit card numbers and started hosing both our accounts. It’s been a fiasco. We’ve had to shut down every scrap of plastic in the house, spend hours on the phone with the credit bureaus to flag us (because the money has been going to an overseas company that presses shady credit cards for any fool desperate enough to pay the activation fee) and with our banks, not to mention the local police and FBI. [...] Last night after having the job yanked from under my nose, the cats were all over me. They seem to know when Mama feels like hell. Brandy sat on me and purred like a little diesel engine. Stosh lay by my feet, and Roxie and Odessa kept coming to look in on me. I thank God for them. They’re not capable of the bullshit that human beings heap upon one another.

Purrs for a speedy resolution to the identity theft. It’s good that you have your kitties to comfort you.

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I’ve missed you good folk and I’m sorry I haven’t been about. But this past week or so has sucked majestically.

{{{Baha}}} We’re so very sorry that life is kicking you around right now.  The five furkids are sending purrs and gentle headbutts and I’m sending hugs that things get better soon.  Rant all you want here, we’re always willing to listen and send purrs. Julie, Hobbes, Selena, Lacey, Sam and Barnabus

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… the cats were all over me. They seem to know when Mama feels like hell. Brandy sat on me and purred like a little diesel engine. Stosh lay by my feet, and Roxie and Odessa kept coming to look in on me. I thank God for them. They’re not capable of the bullshit that human beings heap upon one another.

Purrs for things to improve.  Kitties always seem to know, don’t they, when we need some ‘up close and personal’ purrs.  Give them all a skritch for me. Regards and Purrs, O J

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[...] Last night after having the job yanked from under my nose, the cats were all over me. They seem to know when Mama feels like hell.

[...] That really stinks about the identity theft.  Many purrs also for the rest of your troubles. May it get better soon! — Cheryl

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – On top of this, my work has asked me to get an evaluation for what was thought to be dyslexia. I’d been having trouble following certain instructions, getting all bollixed up when I had to do a multistep task for a customer’s account. It’s not dyslexia. I’ve had ADHD all this time, and on top of it I’ve just learned that I have a learning disability known as cognitive memory dysfunction. The sympoms tend to overlap with those of dyslexia. The bank is ready to toss me out on my @r$e. I’ve been put on Strattera as a trial for the ADHD, but little can be done about the other stuff. I’ve just lost an opportunity to advance because of this damnable thing, which has been disclosed to the company, the schmucks. I’m thinking of giving them a bill. Even with the insurance, my money would be beter spent on catnip for the babies and a nice, expensive lipstick for their hardworking mama. My psychiatrist is having kittens himself. My bipolar/OCD is a bastard to treat as it is, and throwing ADHD in the mix is a recipe for disaster. He and I are both concerned about me remaining employable. Now more than ever.

Purrs, sympathy and making it right thoughts and wishes for you and your tribulations.  Mandy also has cognitive memory dysfunction, but it’s easier to explain it to others as visual dyslexia.  It tends to go hand in hand with ADHD and ADD.  Mandy received "speech" therapy for it and can now do as many as three simple demands without losing it. I don’t know about medications for it, I hope yours help you out without messing up your bipolar/OCD treatments as well.  Thanks Bast for cats to soothe the pain away. Pam, Rob, and the Fayetteville Five + Calvin, Sonya, and Speedy the d-thing

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve missed you good folk and I’m sorry I haven’t been about. But this past week or so has sucked majestically. On top of this, my work has asked me to get an evaluation for what was thought to be dyslexia. I’d been having trouble following certain instructions, getting all bollixed up when I had to do a multistep task for a customer’s account. It’s not dyslexia. I’ve had ADHD all this time, and on top of it I’ve just learned that I have a learning disability known as cognitive memory dysfunction. The sympoms tend to overlap with those of dyslexia. The bank is ready to toss me out on my @r$e. I’ve been put on Strattera as a trial for the ADHD, but little can be done about the other stuff. I’ve just lost an opportunity to advance because of this damnable thing, which has been disclosed to the company, the schmucks. I’m thinking of giving them a bill. Even with the insurance, my money would be beter spent on catnip for the babies and a nice, expensive lipstick for their hardworking mama. My psychiatrist is having kittens himself. My bipolar/OCD is a bastard to treat as it is, and throwing ADHD in the mix is a recipe for disaster. He and I are both concerned about me remaining employable. Now more than ever. Last night after having the job yanked from under my nose, the cats were all over me. They seem to know when Mama feels like hell. Brandy sat on me and purred like a little diesel engine. Stosh lay by my feet, and Roxie and Odessa kept coming to look in on me. I thank God for them. They’re not capable of the bullshit that human beings heap upon one another.

Why is it that even blessings are sometimes delivered with so much excess baggage?  It sounds like being away from that job will be a good thing, other than the loss of income.  And when things are off, a proper diagnosis is truly a blessing.  As for how it was handled, it sure sounds like you should qualify for at least some temporary disability rather than unemployment (the former isn’t taxable) and maybe some compensation for the way it was all processed. I know you don’t know what you are going to do next.  But I’m sure it will be a good thing.  A way to be that you can be at peace with yourself and the world around you. Jo

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I go around with my bank on this one every so often.  I have an ATM card.  I do not have and do not want a debit card.  I do not need some schmuck screwing around in my checking account.  Even innocent (maybe) mistakes can be a royal PITA.

Problem is, the banks want to go paperless. Some actually charge for using checks now. Their goal is, I believe, to phase out paper in the next 5 years. One of these days there will be no choice.

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Hi Baha I’m so sorry about this whole mess. I hope it all gets straightened out soon. I agree w/Jo that you should be able to get Temporary Disability, unless & until your psych. determines that you are unemployable. Then you should be able to get permanent disability. There’s a person at work here who is applying for temp. disability on the basis of mental helth, so why not a diagnosed disability? And I have a friend who is on perm. disability for a mental health diagnosis.

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Hi Baha I’m so sorry about this whole mess. I hope it all gets straightened out soon. I agree w/Jo that you should be able to get Temporary Disability, unless & until your psych. determines that you are unemployable. Then you should be able to get permanent disability. There’s a person at work here who is applying for temp. disability on the basis of mental helth, so why not a diagnosed disability? And I have a friend who is on perm. disability for a mental health diagnosis.

I agree with what you said. Jill

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I’ve missed you good folk and I’m sorry I haven’t been about. But this past week or so has sucked majestically. We discovered last week that some filthbag had stolen our debit card numbers and started hosing both our accounts. It’s been a fiasco. We’ve had to shut down every scrap of plastic in the house, spend hours on the phone with the credit bureaus to flag us (because the money has been going to an overseas company that presses shady credit cards for any fool desperate enough to pay the activation fee) and with our banks, not to mention the local police and FBI. In short, my identity is floating around out there somewhere, and some five-hundred pound, unwashed man is calling himself Elizabeth and ordering foreign porn featuring teenagers. The cards will be replaced with new numbers, but that will take a bit of time, and for the moment just going to the store is a nightmare. We went to get groceries Saturday night and it took almost an hour to get approved to cash a check. I remember when you could write one right at the counter, no problem. Now? 17 forms of ID, a police check, character references from your great-aunt in Boise, a letter from your priest-rabbi-imam-highpriestessofDiana. We ended up very late for Joycie’s birthday party (out of nursing home, responding very well to radiation, tumor shrunk, good news in all this mess.) On top of this, my work has asked me to get an evaluation for what was thought to be dyslexia. I’d been having trouble following certain instructions, getting all bollixed up when I had to do a multistep task for a customer’s account. It’s not dyslexia. I’ve had ADHD all this time, and on top of it I’ve just learned that I have a learning disability known as cognitive memory dysfunction. The sympoms tend to overlap with those of dyslexia. The bank is ready to toss me out on my @r$e. I’ve been put on Strattera as a trial for the ADHD, but little can be done about the other stuff. I’ve just lost an opportunity to advance because of this damnable thing, which has been disclosed to the company, the schmucks. I’m thinking of giving them a bill. Even with the insurance, my money would be beter spent on catnip for the babies and a nice, expensive lipstick for their hardworking mama. My psychiatrist is having kittens himself. My bipolar/OCD is a bastard to treat as it is, and throwing ADHD in the mix is a recipe for disaster. He and I are both concerned about me remaining employable. Now more than ever. Last night after having the job yanked from under my nose, the cats were all over me. They seem to know when Mama feels like hell. Brandy sat on me and purred like a little diesel engine. Stosh lay by my feet, and Roxie and Odessa kept coming to look in on me. I thank God for them. They’re not capable of the bullshit that human beings heap upon one another. Blessed be, Baha

{{{{Baha}}}}} I am so sorry you are going through all this.  May better times be directly ahead! Ginger-lyn Home Pages:   http://www.spiritrealm.com/summer/   http://www.angelfire.com/folk/glsummer (homepage & cats)   http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~summer/index.htm (genealogy)   http://www.i-love-cats.com/meow/glsummer/ (The Violence Against                                              Animals in Movies Website)

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Big Hugs Baha – you sure need them. {{{{HUGS}}}} I’ve lost your email about what we discussed re.AP. Could you send it to me again? Purrs for good things to happen. Helen M

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yodeled: <Big snip Dear Baha, big ol’ purrs to clear away all the BS.   Theresa Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh My Blog: http://www.humanitas.blogspot.com

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On 2005-03-01, Singh penned: I’ve missed you good folk and I’m sorry I haven’t been about. But this past week or so has sucked majestically.

It sure sounds like it did.  What a nasty time for you. [snip stuff about identity theft] God, I hate that crap!  I’ve had two incidents, one being an eight dollar charge that the company returned when I called and said, "Yo, I didn’t order anything from you" (I suspect they have a list of CCs, charge every one of them $8 and wait to see if anyone notices.)  The second time, I found a $3K charge from Hong Kong and called my credit union immediately.  They locked down the card.  Apparently the first charge was just a test; a few days later the same organization tried to charge me $17K! With all of this, I’m pretty paranoid about my finances.  I check my credit card and bank balance online every few days.  (That’s how I caught the $3K charge before they tried the bigger one.)  My bank also issues Visa check cards by default, and I traded mine in for a pure ATM card.  I figure even if it’s stolen, it can’t be used as a debit or credit card this way. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – On top of this, my work has asked me to get an evaluation for what was thought to be dyslexia. I’d been having trouble following certain instructions, getting all bollixed up when I had to do a multistep task for a customer’s account. It’s not dyslexia. I’ve had ADHD all this time, and on top of it I’ve just learned that I have a learning disability known as cognitive memory dysfunction. The sympoms tend to overlap with those of dyslexia. The bank is ready to toss me out on my @r$e. I’ve been put on Strattera as a trial for the ADHD, but little can be done about the other stuff. I’ve just lost an opportunity to advance because of this damnable thing, which has been disclosed to the company, the schmucks. I’m thinking of giving them a bill. Even with the insurance, my money would be beter spent on catnip for the babies and a nice, expensive lipstick for their hardworking mama. My psychiatrist is having kittens himself. My bipolar/OCD is a bastard to treat as it is, and throwing ADHD in the mix is a recipe for disaster. He and I are both concerned about me remaining employable. Now more than ever.

I’m confused.  Is it even legal to fire someone or refuse them a promotion based on an illness?  I guess you can’t prove that it’s for that reason. Still, yuck! Last night after having the job yanked from under my nose, the cats were all over me. They seem to know when Mama feels like hell. Brandy sat on me and purred like a little diesel engine. Stosh lay by my feet, and Roxie and Odessa kept coming to look in on me. I thank God for them. They’re not capable of the bullshit that human beings heap upon one another.

Good kitties =) — monique, who spoils Oscar unmercifully pictures: http://www.bounceswoosh.org/rpca

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SNIP Last night after having the job yanked from under my nose, the cats were all over me. They seem to know when Mama feels like hell. Brandy sat on me and purred like a little diesel engine. Stosh lay by my feet, and Roxie and Odessa kept coming to look in on me. I thank God for them. They’re not capable of the bullshit that human beings heap upon one another. Blessed be, Baha — Three thousand years ago, cats were deified in ancient Egypt. To this day, they have not forgotten.

Big hugs, Singh.  Any one of the things you describe would be enough to ruin anybody’s week all by themselves. But all of them at once…oy!  I hope things look up, soon.   Thank goodness for cats, they’re a great comfort. I’m convinced they do pick up on human emotions, even if they understand the reasons for those feelings.  They just know that Mama needs some comfort and companionship and apply themselves to the task. Melissa

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve missed you good folk and I’m sorry I haven’t been about. But this past week or so has sucked majestically. We discovered last week that some filthbag had stolen our debit card numbers and started hosing both our accounts. It’s been a fiasco. We’ve had to shut down every scrap of plastic in the house, spend hours on the phone with the credit bureaus to flag us (because the money has been going to an overseas company that presses shady credit cards for any fool desperate enough to pay the activation fee) and with our banks, not to mention the local police and FBI. In short, my identity is floating around out there somewhere, and some five-hundred pound, unwashed man is calling himself Elizabeth and ordering foreign porn featuring teenagers. The cards will be replaced with new numbers, but that will take a bit of time, and for the moment just going to the store is a nightmare. We went to get groceries Saturday night and it took almost an hour to get approved to cash a check. I remember when you could write one right at the counter, no problem. Now? 17 forms of ID, a police check, character references from your great-aunt in Boise, a letter from your priest-rabbi-imam-highpriestessofDiana. We ended up very late for Joycie’s birthday party (out of nursing home, responding very well to radiation, tumor shrunk, good news in all this mess.)

I go around with my bank on this one every so often.  I have an ATM card.  I do not have and do not want a debit card.  I do not need some schmuck screwing around in my checking account.  Even innocent (maybe) mistakes can be a royal PITA.  Such as when my daughter and a friend went out and rather than swiping each of their cards, they ran Tara’s twice.  Its easier to close a credit card account that gets fouled up and open a different one. So sorry you are getting run through this particular mill and hope it settles down soon. Wonderful news about Joyce.  Give her an extra hug from me OK? Jo

Response:

I’m so sorry to hear about all your troubles. We’re sending lots of purrs for things to sort out quickly and for your treatment to help you improve soon. — Victor M. Martinez Owned and operated by the Fantastic Seven (TM)

Response:

Wow, that’s one helluvatime! Purrs that everything improves PDQ Gordon & the TT – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve missed you good folk and I’m sorry I haven’t been about. But this past week or so has sucked majestically.

Response:

I’ve missed you good folk and I’m sorry I haven’t been about. But this past week or so has sucked majestically. We discovered last week that some filthbag had stolen our debit card numbers and started hosing both our accounts. It’s been a fiasco. Blessed be, Baha

Oh man, that just bites!  I hope this filth doesn’t have your Social Security Number(s), too!  I know of a poster on another ng who is going through something similar – someone bought a car in his name, wrecked it… you know where this is going.  Same kinda crap you’re dealing with.  Hope they catch all these identity-theft scumbags soon. Jill

Response:

I’ve missed you good folk and I’m sorry I haven’t been about. But this past week or so has sucked majestically.

No kidding!  I’m so sorry to hear about all that.  I have ADHD and dyslexia along with a touch of OCD, so I know a bit about what you’re going through. I finally had to just look for the positive in all this – I’m a perfectionist who has the energy to keep at it until I’m satisfied with the outcome, and I’m a great multi-tasker (I *HAVE* to multi-task since I can’t keep focused on just one thing at a time). I hope you get your credit cards straightened out in short order – living without plastic is almost impossible now-a-days! Mega purrs on the way!!! Hugs, CatNipped

Response:

I’ve missed you good folk and I’m sorry I haven’t been about. But this past week or so has sucked majestically. We discovered last week that some filthbag had stolen our debit card numbers and started hosing both our accounts. It’s been a fiasco. We’ve had to shut down every scrap of plastic in the house, spend hours on the phone with the credit bureaus to flag us (because the money has been going to an overseas company that presses shady credit cards for any fool desperate enough to pay the activation fee) and with our banks, not to mention the local police and FBI. In short, my identity is floating around out there somewhere, and some five-hundred pound, unwashed man is calling himself Elizabeth and ordering foreign porn featuring teenagers. The cards will be replaced with new numbers, but that will take a bit of time, and for the moment just going to the store is a nightmare. We went to get groceries Saturday night and it took almost an hour to get approved to cash a check. I remember when you could write one right at the counter, no problem. Now? 17 forms of ID, a police check, character references from your great-aunt in Boise, a letter from your priest-rabbi-imam-highpriestessofDiana. We ended up very late for Joycie’s birthday party (out of nursing home, responding very well to radiation, tumor shrunk, good news in all this mess.) On top of this, my work has asked me to get an evaluation for what was thought to be dyslexia. I’d been having trouble following certain instructions, getting all bollixed up when I had to do a multistep task for a customer’s account. It’s not dyslexia. I’ve had ADHD all this time, and on top of it I’ve just learned that I have a learning disability known as cognitive memory dysfunction. The sympoms tend to overlap with those of dyslexia. The bank is ready to toss me out on my @r$e. I’ve been put on Strattera as a trial for the ADHD, but little can be done about the other stuff. I’ve just lost an opportunity to advance because of this damnable thing, which has been disclosed to the company, the schmucks. I’m thinking of giving them a bill. Even with the insurance, my money would be beter spent on catnip for the babies and a nice, expensive lipstick for their hardworking mama. My psychiatrist is having kittens himself. My bipolar/OCD is a bastard to treat as it is, and throwing ADHD in the mix is a recipe for disaster. He and I are both concerned about me remaining employable. Now more than ever. Last night after having the job yanked from under my nose, the cats were all over me. They seem to know when Mama feels like hell. Brandy sat on me and purred like a little diesel engine. Stosh lay by my feet, and Roxie and Odessa kept coming to look in on me. I thank God for them. They’re not capable of the bullshit that human beings heap upon one another. Blessed be, Baha — Three thousand years ago, cats were deified in ancient Egypt. To this day, they have not forgotten.

Response:

My lozenge is a full earthy herbal lozenge incorporating a miscellanea of weeds known for advancing sexual longing and performance, causing an increase in sexual craving, a betterment in your volume and execution, besides as increased energy and joy during sexual activeness.

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Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Whether or not it’s proven, what I’m talking about is real, exists, and doesn’t have to be treated specifically with Irlen lenses. Way to read for content. If you carefully read what I said, this time for comprehension, you would understand my point. Can you all kindly fuck off, and take your crappy quoting skills somewhere else? We’re not interested here in uk.comp.sys.mac, and I suspect the poor things over at microsoft.public.pocketpc have enough misery in their lives without having to deal with this as well. Follow-ups set to alt.support.dyslexia. Daniele

Mark was posting from neither of those groups.  Some of the folks in ASAD shoot from the hip.  Mark says he doesn’t have ADD but he has at least an honorary dx. If someone included the words "Hamsters have dyslexia"  in their sig line would you respond favorably? **Guinea pigs have ADD. No they don’t.  They are small rodents that want out of their cages. _george

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My question to you is, What is the point in telling everyone it’s quackery?

 Mark’s posting from alt.support.attn-deficit.  A wide range of alt.snake-oil therapies have been sold as "cures" for ADHD.   In the case of ADHD the point is to use appraoches that are effective. I looked at your web site, Janna.  You’re doing good stuff. Aloha, _george

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My question to you is, What is the point in telling everyone it’s quackery?  Mark’s posting from alt.support.attn-deficit.  A wide range of alt.snake-oil therapies have been sold as "cures" for ADHD.   In the case of ADHD the point is to use appraoches that are effective. I looked at your web site, Janna.  You’re doing good stuff. Aloha, _george

Thanks. And my point of course is not that Irlen lenses cure ADHD or autism (how stupid would that be?) but that visual processing problems are real and coloured lenses (not necessarily Irlens) can help alleviate those problems. -Janna — Another random thought from my random brain… Brought to you by the colour green, the number 7, and the letters J, L, and H. http://geocities.com/janna_louise Guinea pigs have ADD. "Home is not a place.  It is wherever your passion takes you." – President John Sheridan, Babylon 5 (Objects At Rest, Production #522) "If you don’t like the way the world is, you change it.  You have an obligation to change it.  You just do it one step at a time.  You really can change the world if you care enough." – Mary Wright Edelman Psalm 42:7

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If someone included the words "Hamsters have dyslexia"  in their sig line would you respond favorably? **Guinea pigs have ADD. No they don’t.  They are small rodents that want out of their cages. _george

Yeah, they do.  I have two females who live together in a 6′ wading pool in my living room. Last week they were chasing each other around the cage, and all of a sudden the one who was doing the chasing stopped running and started chewing on something.  The other one kept going until she realized that she wasn’t being chased anymore, so she decided it was the perfect time to chew on the water bottle. Trust me. ADD.  ;) -Janna (related to guinea pigs) — Another random thought from my random brain… Brought to you by the colour green, the number 7, and the letters J, L, and H. http://geocities.com/janna_louise Guinea pigs have ADD. "Home is not a place.  It is wherever your passion takes you." – President John Sheridan, Babylon 5 (Objects At Rest, Production #522) "If you don’t like the way the world is, you change it.  You have an obligation to change it.  You just do it one step at a time.  You really can change the world if you care enough." – Mary Wright Edelman Psalm 42:7

Response:

Is there anyone clever enough to know how to change it on the iPaq? I can do in on Win XP: control panel: display – appearance – "Window Text" can change color (colour -uk) in most applications. (can this be done on a Mac?) Help please.

I would re-post that question to comp.sys.mac.apps … Most of the Big Wigs in the Mac world hang out there. I have never gone unsatisfied with the help I’ve gotten there. Cheers SP — Not a real Addy, yet

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My question to you is, What is the point in telling everyone it’s quackery?  Mark’s posting from alt.support.attn-deficit.  A wide range of alt.snake-oil therapies have been sold as "cures" for ADHD.   In the case of ADHD the point is to use appraoches that are effective. I looked at your web site, Janna.  You’re doing good stuff. Aloha, _george Thanks. And my point of course is not that Irlen lenses cure ADHD or autism (how stupid would that be?) but that visual processing problems are real and coloured lenses (not necessarily Irlens) can help alleviate those problems. -Janna

Even if it’s a placebo effect in many cases, a placebo is better than doing nothing.  With reading, anything that gives the kid a boost in confidence is good. Yes, visual processing problems are real.  I have had some nasty migranes with weird visual effects. I had a weird visual problem driving today where tracks of burned rubber on the road made me dizzy. _george

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For Irlens Sydrome (often assoc with Dyslexia and ADHD) for more information on the so-called Irlen Syndrome, see: http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/eyequack.html http://pavlov.psyc.queensu.ca/~psyc365/devdys/5.html As far as I can see, this "syndrome" has not been proven in any manner and is not recognized. With costs of $500.00 and more, it seems like a fleece job. I work with autistic children and have some vision sensitivities myself. There is a simple (almost free) testing procedure that you can use *before* you go the Irlen advisory route.  It’s very simple and really only requires the purchase of several coloured lightbulbs. Once you’ve completed the testing procedure, you can choose to either try different sunglasses in shades of the colour you have tested out on, or you can contact the Irlen people and get the precise testing done. One child I work with needs the colour red.  We found this by using the simple testing procedure and will probably not bother with the Irlen testing, as he seems content with any colour of red we can provide.  I make his worksheets on red paper as much as I can, and he has constant access to red sunglasses.  His printing improved dramatically from his last white sheet to his first red sheet.  His frustration has decreased, and he is more willing to do paperwork than he was prior to learning this and making adaptations. If anyone is interested in acquiring the testing procedure, e-mail me off-list and I will send it to you.  (Yes, for free.) I myself came out mildly yellow, but haven’t yet had the opportunity to try the adaptations we implemented for the above child as I wear glasses and can’t currently afford to get sunglasses to clip on. While interesting, your point does not provide proof of the existence of the so-called Irlen Syndrome. From all my reading, it is quackery. Whether or not it’s proven, what I’m talking about is real, exists, and doesn’t have to be treated specifically with Irlen lenses. Way to read for content. If you carefully read what I said, this time for comprehension, you would understand my point.

Okay, one more time because I wasn’t totally on the ball with the last two posts. What I wrote about vision problems and using coloured lenses *was specifically written to make it clear that you don’t have to go to Irlen if you think you might have trouble with colours*. The testing I mentioned is absolutely 100% simple to do, and I can send it to anyone who wants it.  For free.  All they have to do is collect the materials, which (aside from the coloured light bulbs) are everyday items anyone has in their home. So, again… way to read for content. Sheesh. The one link you provide does allow for the existence of vision problems that are alleviated by coloured lenses.  That the one group was perfectly happy with mere tinted lenses rather than the Irlen lenses means literally *nothing* and does not impact *my* point. -Janna — Another random thought from my random brain… Brought to you by the colour green, the number 7, and the letters J, L, and H. http://geocities.com/janna_louise Guinea pigs have ADD. "Home is not a place.  It is wherever your passion takes you." – President John Sheridan, Babylon 5 (Objects At Rest, Production #522) "If you don’t like the way the world is, you change it.  You have an obligation to change it.  You just do it one step at a time.  You really can change the world if you care enough." – Mary Wright Edelman Psalm 42:7

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For Irlens Sydrome (often assoc with Dyslexia and ADHD) for more information on the so-called Irlen Syndrome, see: http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/eyequack.html http://pavlov.psyc.queensu.ca/~psyc365/devdys/5.html As far as I can see, this "syndrome" has not been proven in any manner and is not recognized. With costs of $500.00 and more, it seems like a fleece job. I work with autistic children and have some vision sensitivities myself. There is a simple (almost free) testing procedure that you can use *before* you go the Irlen advisory route.  It’s very simple and really only requires the purchase of several coloured lightbulbs. Once you’ve completed the testing procedure, you can choose to either try different sunglasses in shades of the colour you have tested out on, or you can contact the Irlen people and get the precise testing done. One child I work with needs the colour red.  We found this by using the simple testing procedure and will probably not bother with the Irlen testing, as he seems content with any colour of red we can provide.  I make his worksheets on red paper as much as I can, and he has constant access to red sunglasses.  His printing improved dramatically from his last white sheet to his first red sheet.  His frustration has decreased, and he is more willing to do paperwork than he was prior to learning this and making adaptations. If anyone is interested in acquiring the testing procedure, e-mail me off-list and I will send it to you.  (Yes, for free.) I myself came out mildly yellow, but haven’t yet had the opportunity to try the adaptations we implemented for the above child as I wear glasses and can’t currently afford to get sunglasses to clip on. While interesting, your point does not provide proof of the existence of the so-called Irlen Syndrome. From all my reading, it is quackery.

Perhaps, but headaches from looking at computer screens are very real. And I know I prefer to look at the world -literally- through rose colored glasses.  Unfortunately, I have been seeing the world through clear lenses lately. _george

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For Irlens Sydrome (often assoc with Dyslexia and ADHD) for more information on the so-called Irlen Syndrome, see: http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/eyequack.html http://pavlov.psyc.queensu.ca/~psyc365/devdys/5.html As far as I can see, this "syndrome" has not been proven in any manner and is not recognized. With costs of $500.00 and more, it seems like a fleece job. I work with autistic children and have some vision sensitivities myself. There is a simple (almost free) testing procedure that you can use *before* you go the Irlen advisory route.  It’s very simple and really only requires the purchase of several coloured lightbulbs. Once you’ve completed the testing procedure, you can choose to either try different sunglasses in shades of the colour you have tested out on, or you can contact the Irlen people and get the precise testing done. One child I work with needs the colour red.  We found this by using the simple testing procedure and will probably not bother with the Irlen testing, as he seems content with any colour of red we can provide.  I make his worksheets on red paper as much as I can, and he has constant access to red sunglasses.  His printing improved dramatically from his last white sheet to his first red sheet.  His frustration has decreased, and he is more willing to do paperwork than he was prior to learning this and making adaptations. If anyone is interested in acquiring the testing procedure, e-mail me off-list and I will send it to you.  (Yes, for free.) I myself came out mildly yellow, but haven’t yet had the opportunity to try the adaptations we implemented for the above child as I wear glasses and can’t currently afford to get sunglasses to clip on. While interesting, your point does not provide proof of the existence of the so-called Irlen Syndrome. From all my reading, it is quackery. Perhaps, but headaches from looking at computer screens are very real. And I know I prefer to look at the world -literally- through rose colored glasses.  Unfortunately, I have been seeing the world through clear lenses lately. _george

It can have a lot to do with the ‘flicker’. There is the LCD flicker … and the flourescent backlight flicker. For whatever reason, I have always foun it much more difficult to read inverted ‘white on black’  … such as reading from a chalkboard. … the ‘reading’ is easy. … the MEANING just doesn’t seem to ‘register’. I don’t know if my experience in unusual or ‘common’   …. "Black on white" has become the norm. It does occur to me that if ‘flicker’ is involved in a specific kind of way, it may be preferable to ‘invert’ Example:  Think of ’slow’ or ‘fast’ phosphours and ‘inverting’ in the old crt monitiors.   ( assuming that you can remember those things … ) flicker and it’s frequency can make a big difference.  … as can contrast … as can ‘typeface’ .. as I find as I get older.  .. as I get older, it is more difficult for me to focus near or focus far.  … ’stare’ at a computer too long and go ‘cross-eyed’ in the distance. … it’s NOT just eye focus!  … it has to do with binocular vison processing. If I get my nose out of my computer; … after a few days, things go back to normal and I don’t go about ‘cross eyed’ … and on and on and on … So many factors are involved. Go in with your head "up". P.S I wish they would make ‘incandescent’ backlights  …or… explore different florescent flicker rates … RL Actually I don’t dislike him.  Just don’t have any help to offer him and don’t find attempting to make sense of his ravings a productive use of my time.  I’ve killfiled several people for whom I have a good deal of respect because of the wrangle factor is jclarke  (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net) ignoring you too?

Response:

reading black text on a *white* background causes headaches.  Is there anyone clever enough to know how to change it on the iPaq? I can do in on Win XP: control panel: display – appearance – "Window Text" can change color (colour -uk) in most applications. (can this be done on a Mac?)

I don’t know what an iPaq is, but on Mac OS X you do it with    System Preferences Universal Access Switch to White on Black There are ways of doing it on earlier systems, but I seem to have mislaid the relevant control panel on my OS 9.1 machine. I remember doing it with a third-party utility on a system around 3.2 in the late 1980s, so probably all Macs ever made can do it.  Both that old one and the current one in Panther share a little design bug; the rounded corners of the screen display get inverted from black to white, making distracting little bright quadrants. You can also set background colour on a per-window basis in both MacOS X and the X11 window system (what most Linux people use). Under the Motif window manager on SunOS, I used to reserve girly pink for chat windows with a particular person.  One of my colleagues had all his text edit windows snot-green because he’d read in some user interface research paper that it reduced error rates.  Working on his machine made me feel slightly nauseous. Jack Campin:  11 Third St, Newtongrange EH22 4PU, Scotland | tel 0131 660 4760 <http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/jack/   for CD-ROMs and free | fax 0870 0554 975 stuff: Scottish music, food intolerance, & Mac logic fonts | mob 07800 739 557

Response:

Whether or not it’s proven, what I’m talking about is real

Oh, God!         -z- — My lozenge is a full earthy herbal lozenge incorporating a miscellanea of weeds known for advancing sexual longing and performance, causing an increase in sexual craving, a betterment in your volume and execution, besides as increased energy and joy during sexual activeness.

Response:

For Irlens Sydrome (often assoc with Dyslexia and ADHD) reading black text on a *white* background causes headaches. Is there anyone clever enough to know how to change it on the iPaq? I can do in on Win XP: control panel: display – appearance – "Window Text" can change color (colour -uk) in most applications. (can this be done on a Mac?)

On the Mac – ctrl-option-command-8 HTH.         -z- — My lozenge is a full earthy herbal lozenge incorporating a miscellanea of weeds known for advancing sexual longing and performance, causing an increase in sexual craving, a betterment in your volume and execution, besides as increased energy and joy during sexual activeness.

Response:

For Irlens Sydrome (often assoc with Dyslexia and ADHD) reading black text on a *white* background causes headaches. Is there anyone clever enough to know how to change it on the iPaq? I can do in on Win XP: control panel: display – appearance – "Window Text" can change color (colour -uk) in most applications. (can this be done on a Mac?) Help please.

Response:

For Irlens Sydrome (often assoc with Dyslexia and ADHD) reading black text on a *white* background causes headaches. Is there anyone clever enough to know how to change it on the iPaq? I can do in on Win XP: control panel: display – appearance – "Window Text" can change color (colour -uk) in most applications. (can this be done on a Mac?) Help please.

Universal Access Control Panel is your friend. Bob W

Response:

For Irlens Sydrome (often assoc with Dyslexia and ADHD)

for more information on the so-called Irlen Syndrome, see: http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/eyequack.html http://pavlov.psyc.queensu.ca/~psyc365/devdys/5.html As far as I can see, this "syndrome" has not been proven in any manner and is not recognized. With costs of $500.00 and more, it seems like a fleece job.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For Irlens Sydrome (often assoc with Dyslexia and ADHD) for more information on the so-called Irlen Syndrome, see: http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/eyequack.html http://pavlov.psyc.queensu.ca/~psyc365/devdys/5.html As far as I can see, this "syndrome" has not been proven in any manner and is not recognized. With costs of $500.00 and more, it seems like a fleece job.

I work with autistic children and have some vision sensitivities myself. There is a simple (almost free) testing procedure that you can use *before* you go the Irlen advisory route.  It’s very simple and really only requires the purchase of several coloured lightbulbs. Once you’ve completed the testing procedure, you can choose to either try different sunglasses in shades of the colour you have tested out on, or you can contact the Irlen people and get the precise testing done. One child I work with needs the colour red.  We found this by using the simple testing procedure and will probably not bother with the Irlen testing, as he seems content with any colour of red we can provide.  I make his worksheets on red paper as much as I can, and he has constant access to red sunglasses.  His printing improved dramatically from his last white sheet to his first red sheet.  His frustration has decreased, and he is more willing to do paperwork than he was prior to learning this and making adaptations. If anyone is interested in acquiring the testing procedure, e-mail me off-list and I will send it to you.  (Yes, for free.) I myself came out mildly yellow, but haven’t yet had the opportunity to try the adaptations we implemented for the above child as I wear glasses and can’t currently afford to get sunglasses to clip on. -Janna — Another random thought from my random brain… Brought to you by the colour green, the number 7, and the letters J, L, and H. http://geocities.com/janna_louise Guinea pigs have ADD. "Home is not a place.  It is wherever your passion takes you." – President John Sheridan, Babylon 5 (Objects At Rest, Production #522) "If you don’t like the way the world is, you change it.  You have an obligation to change it.  You just do it one step at a time.  You really can change the world if you care enough." – Mary Wright Edelman Psalm 42:7

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For Irlens Sydrome (often assoc with Dyslexia and ADHD) for more information on the so-called Irlen Syndrome, see: http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/eyequack.html http://pavlov.psyc.queensu.ca/~psyc365/devdys/5.html As far as I can see, this "syndrome" has not been proven in any manner and is not recognized. With costs of $500.00 and more, it seems like a fleece job. I work with autistic children and have some vision sensitivities myself. There is a simple (almost free) testing procedure that you can use *before* you go the Irlen advisory route.  It’s very simple and really only requires the purchase of several coloured lightbulbs. Once you’ve completed the testing procedure, you can choose to either try different sunglasses in shades of the colour you have tested out on, or you can contact the Irlen people and get the precise testing done. One child I work with needs the colour red.  We found this by using the simple testing procedure and will probably not bother with the Irlen testing, as he seems content with any colour of red we can provide.  I make his worksheets on red paper as much as I can, and he has constant access to red sunglasses.  His printing improved dramatically from his last white sheet to his first red sheet.  His frustration has decreased, and he is more willing to do paperwork than he was prior to learning this and making adaptations. If anyone is interested in acquiring the testing procedure, e-mail me off-list and I will send it to you.  (Yes, for free.) I myself came out mildly yellow, but haven’t yet had the opportunity to try the adaptations we implemented for the above child as I wear glasses and can’t currently afford to get sunglasses to clip on.

While interesting, your point does not provide proof of the existence of the so-called Irlen Syndrome. From all my reading, it is quackery.

Response:

For Irlens Sydrome (often assoc with Dyslexia and ADHD) for more information on the so-called Irlen Syndrome, see: http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/eyequack.html http://pavlov.psyc.queensu.ca/~psyc365/devdys/5.html As far as I can see, this "syndrome" has not been proven in any manner and is not recognized. With costs of $500.00 and more, it seems like a fleece job.

(X-post removed from my post) Hang on. Is this the same thing as ‘meers-irlen’ syndrome (my spelling may be off). My friends son has been diagnosed with this along with his dyslexia and dyspraxia in Glasgow, Scotland – as has my daughter’s boyfriend, and two kids I know at my youngest’s school. What it means to them is being prescribed coloured lenses (blue and green respectively, and I know a girl with yellow lenses), to help them with their reading. The boy with blue glasses also has blue paper, and both in conjunction, as he says ’stops the letters jumping up and down’.  Bear in mind, all this treatment is available on the UK National Health Service, so no incentive for fleecing, as it were. Just wondering? ) — Grymma AFPOh Goddess Of Hangovers; B.F.(use ‘reply to’) Sometimes I make a mental note, but then forget where I put it.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For Irlens Sydrome (often assoc with Dyslexia and ADHD) for more information on the so-called Irlen Syndrome, see: http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/eyequack.html http://pavlov.psyc.queensu.ca/~psyc365/devdys/5.html As far as I can see, this "syndrome" has not been proven in any manner and is not recognized. With costs of $500.00 and more, it seems like a fleece job. I work with autistic children and have some vision sensitivities myself. There is a simple (almost free) testing procedure that you can use *before* you go the Irlen advisory route.  It’s very simple and really only requires the purchase of several coloured lightbulbs. Once you’ve completed the testing procedure, you can choose to either try different sunglasses in shades of the colour you have tested out on, or you can contact the Irlen people and get the precise testing done. One child I work with needs the colour red.  We found this by using the simple testing procedure and will probably not bother with the Irlen testing, as he seems content with any colour of red we can provide.  I make his worksheets on red paper as much as I can, and he has constant access to red sunglasses.  His printing improved dramatically from his last white sheet to his first red sheet.  His frustration has decreased, and he is more willing to do paperwork than he was prior to learning this and making adaptations. If anyone is interested in acquiring the testing procedure, e-mail me off-list and I will send it to you.  (Yes, for free.) I myself came out mildly yellow, but haven’t yet had the opportunity to try the adaptations we implemented for the above child as I wear glasses and can’t currently afford to get sunglasses to clip on.

A suggestion for those who need less contrast than is normally found in textbooks (i.e., black print on white paper), you might try getting some transluscent report covers of varying colors (so you can find the right "fit" for yourself or your student) and slip the "offending" page inside of the cover (i.e., the "spine" of the cover being on the outside of the page). I could not find the "el cheapo" ones that I usually get (at Wal-Mart, target, etc) for illustrative purposes, but one example can be found at http://www.keysan.com/ksu3120b.htm Buny

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For Irlens Sydrome (often assoc with Dyslexia and ADHD) for more information on the so-called Irlen Syndrome, see: http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/eyequack.html http://pavlov.psyc.queensu.ca/~psyc365/devdys/5.html As far as I can see, this "syndrome" has not been proven in any manner and is not recognized. With costs of $500.00 and more, it seems like a fleece job. I work with autistic children and have some vision sensitivities myself. There is a simple (almost free) testing procedure that you can use *before* you go the Irlen advisory route.  It’s very simple and really only requires the purchase of several coloured lightbulbs. Once you’ve completed the testing procedure, you can choose to either try different sunglasses in shades of the colour you have tested out on, or you can contact the Irlen people and get the precise testing done. One child I work with needs the colour red.  We found this by using the simple testing procedure and will probably not bother with the Irlen testing, as he seems content with any colour of red we can provide.  I make his worksheets on red paper as much as I can, and he has constant access to red sunglasses.  His printing improved dramatically from his last white sheet to his first red sheet.  His frustration has decreased, and he is more willing to do paperwork than he was prior to learning this and making adaptations. If anyone is interested in acquiring the testing procedure, e-mail me off-list and I will send it to you.  (Yes, for free.) I myself came out mildly yellow, but haven’t yet had the opportunity to try the adaptations we implemented for the above child as I wear glasses and can’t currently afford to get sunglasses to clip on. While interesting, your point does not provide proof of the existence of the so-called Irlen Syndrome. From all my reading, it is quackery.

Whether or not it’s proven, what I’m talking about is real, exists, and doesn’t have to be treated specifically with Irlen lenses. Way to read for content. -Janna — Another random thought from my random brain… Brought to you by the colour green, the number 7, and the letters J, L, and H. http://geocities.com/janna_louise Guinea pigs have ADD. "Home is not a place.  It is wherever your passion takes you." – President John Sheridan, Babylon 5 (Objects At Rest, Production #522) "If you don’t like the way the world is, you change it.  You have an obligation to change it.  You just do it one step at a time.  You really can change the world if you care enough." – Mary Wright Edelman Psalm 42:7

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For Irlens Sydrome (often assoc with Dyslexia and ADHD) for more information on the so-called Irlen Syndrome, see: http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/eyequack.html http://pavlov.psyc.queensu.ca/~psyc365/devdys/5.html As far as I can see, this "syndrome" has not been proven in any manner and is not recognized. With costs of $500.00 and more, it seems like a fleece job. (X-post removed from my post) Hang on. Is this the same thing as ‘meers-irlen’ syndrome (my spelling may be off). My friends son has been diagnosed with this along with his dyslexia and dyspraxia in Glasgow, Scotland – as has my daughter’s boyfriend, and two kids I know at my youngest’s school. What it means to them is being prescribed coloured lenses (blue and green respectively, and I know a girl with yellow lenses), to help them with their reading. The boy with blue glasses also has blue paper, and both in conjunction, as he says ’stops the letters jumping up and down’.  Bear in mind, all this treatment is available on the UK National Health Service, so no incentive for fleecing, as it were. Just wondering? )

Yes, same thing. My Mom teaches piano to a girl who has to wear pink lenses so the notes stop moving around on the page. -Janna — Another random thought from my random brain… Brought to you by the colour green, the number 7, and the letters J, L, and H. http://geocities.com/janna_louise Guinea pigs have ADD. "Home is not a place.  It is wherever your passion takes you." – President John Sheridan, Babylon 5 (Objects At Rest, Production #522) "If you don’t like the way the world is, you change it.  You have an obligation to change it.  You just do it one step at a time.  You really can change the world if you care enough." – Mary Wright Edelman Psalm 42:7

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For Irlens Sydrome (often assoc with Dyslexia and ADHD) for more information on the so-called Irlen Syndrome, see: http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/eyequack.html http://pavlov.psyc.queensu.ca/~psyc365/devdys/5.html As far as I can see, this "syndrome" has not been proven in any manner and is not recognized. With costs of $500.00 and more, it seems like a fleece job. I work with autistic children and have some vision sensitivities myself. There is a simple (almost free) testing procedure that you can use *before* you go the Irlen advisory route.  It’s very simple and really only requires the purchase of several coloured lightbulbs. Once you’ve completed the testing procedure, you can choose to either try different sunglasses in shades of the colour you have tested out on, or you can contact the Irlen people and get the precise testing done. One child I work with needs the colour red.  We found this by using the simple testing procedure and will probably not bother with the Irlen testing, as he seems content with any colour of red we can provide.  I make his worksheets on red paper as much as I can, and he has constant access to red sunglasses.  His printing improved dramatically from his last white sheet to his first red sheet.  His frustration has decreased, and he is more willing to do paperwork than he was prior to learning this and making adaptations. If anyone is interested in acquiring the testing procedure, e-mail me off-list and I will send it to you.  (Yes, for free.) I myself came out mildly yellow, but haven’t yet had the opportunity to try the adaptations we implemented for the above child as I wear glasses and can’t currently afford to get sunglasses to clip on. While interesting, your point does not provide proof of the existence of the so-called Irlen Syndrome. From all my reading, it is quackery. Whether or not it’s proven, what I’m talking about is real, exists, and doesn’t have to be treated specifically with Irlen lenses. Way to read for content.

If you carefully read what I said, this time for comprehension, you would understand my point.

Response:

Whether or not it’s proven, what I’m talking about is real, exists, and doesn’t have to be treated specifically with Irlen lenses. Way to read for content. If you carefully read what I said, this time for comprehension, you would understand my point.

Can you all kindly fuck off, and take your crappy quoting skills somewhere else? We’re not interested here in uk.comp.sys.mac, and I suspect the poor things over at microsoft.public.pocketpc have enough misery in their lives without having to deal with this as well. Follow-ups set to alt.support.dyslexia. Daniele — Apple Juice Ltd                         Chapter Arts Centre Market Road                                     www.apple-juice.co.uk Cardiff CF5 1QE                                         029 2019 0140

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For Irlens Sydrome (often assoc with Dyslexia and ADHD) for more information on the so-called Irlen Syndrome, see: http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/eyequack.html http://pavlov.psyc.queensu.ca/~psyc365/devdys/5.html As far as I can see, this "syndrome" has not been proven in any manner and is not recognized. With costs of $500.00 and more, it seems like a fleece job. I work with autistic children and have some vision sensitivities myself. There is a simple (almost free) testing procedure that you can use *before* you go the Irlen advisory route.  It’s very simple and really only requires the purchase of several coloured lightbulbs. Once you’ve completed the testing procedure, you can choose to either try different sunglasses in shades of the colour you have tested out on, or you can contact the Irlen people and get the precise testing done. One child I work with needs the colour red.  We found this by using the simple testing procedure and will probably not bother with the Irlen testing, as he seems content with any colour of red we can provide.  I make his worksheets on red paper as much as I can, and he has constant access to red sunglasses.  His printing improved dramatically from his last white sheet to his first red sheet.  His frustration has decreased, and he is more willing to do paperwork than he was prior to learning this and making adaptations. If anyone is interested in acquiring the testing procedure, e-mail me off-list and I will send it to you.  (Yes, for free.) I myself came out mildly yellow, but haven’t yet had the opportunity to try the adaptations we implemented for the above child as I wear glasses and can’t currently afford to get sunglasses to clip on. While interesting, your point does not provide proof of the existence of the so-called Irlen Syndrome. From all my reading, it is quackery. Whether or not it’s proven, what I’m talking about is real, exists, and doesn’t have to be treated specifically with Irlen lenses. Way to read for content. If you carefully read what I said, this time for comprehension, you would understand my point.

My question to you is, What is the point in telling everyone it’s quackery? My point was to give simple information based on my experience.  It’s backed up by many others’ experience.  Just because some scientists somewhere say that it’s not real (based on what criteria, exactly?) doesn’t mean it isn’t real. -Janna (not thinking completely straight – buried under a lot of paperwork ATM) — Another random thought from my random brain… Brought to you by the colour green, the number 7, and the letters J, L, and H. http://geocities.com/janna_louise Guinea pigs have ADD. "Home is not a place.  It is wherever your passion takes you." – President John Sheridan, Babylon 5 (Objects At Rest, Production #522) "If you don’t like the way the world is, you change it.  You have an obligation to change it.  You just do it one step at a time.  You really can change the world if you care enough." – Mary Wright Edelman Psalm 42:7

Response:

  Wow. Is it IRC, or other types of chat? IRC.

   A nice lively time with his speakers, I imagine *grin*. I wonder what type of voices he uses for whom . He’s just an all around amazing person.

   He definitely seems it to me . Be.    Wintershard    www.Alt-Religion-Wicca.com

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – He is quite a remarkable person. He even does chat rooms with his software.   Wow. Is it IRC, or other types of chat? I give credit to the software for also aiding him in that task. That’s quite amazing. Be.   Wintershard   www.Alt-Religion-Wicca.com He is quite a remarkable person. He even does chat rooms with his software.   Wow. Is it IRC, or other types of chat?

IRC. I give credit to the software for also aiding him in that task. That’s quite amazing.

He’s just an all around amazing person. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Be.   Wintershard   www.Alt-Religion-Wicca.com

Response:

Did everyone else see the message doubled up like that, or is Thunderbird acting up on me again? Maybe I should have started from fresh after upgrading. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – He is quite a remarkable person. He even does chat rooms with his software.  Wow. Is it IRC, or other types of chat? I give credit to the software for also aiding him in that task. That’s quite amazing. Be.  Wintershard  www.Alt-Religion-Wicca.com He is quite a remarkable person. He even does chat rooms with his software.  Wow. Is it IRC, or other types of chat? IRC. I give credit to the software for also aiding him in that task. That’s quite amazing. He’s just an all around amazing person. Be.  Wintershard  www.Alt-Religion-Wicca.com

Response:

Did everyone else see the message doubled up like that, or is Thunderbird acting up on me again? Maybe I should have started from fresh after upgrading.

I think it’s my fault. I’ve been noticing it happening a few times over the past couple weeks. I dunno why. I saw it happen to Flase once or twice too. Must be an AOL glitch. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – He is quite a remarkable person. He even does chat rooms with his software.  Wow. Is it IRC, or other types of chat? I give credit to the software for also aiding him in that task. That’s quite amazing. Be.  Wintershard  www.Alt-Religion-Wicca.com He is quite a remarkable person. He even does chat rooms with his software.  Wow. Is it IRC, or other types of chat? IRC. I give credit to the software for also aiding him in that task. That’s quite amazing. He’s just an all around amazing person. Be.  Wintershard  www.Alt-Religion-Wicca.com

Response:

He is quite a remarkable person. He even does chat rooms with his software.

   Wow. Is it IRC, or other types of chat? I give credit to the software for also aiding him in that task. That’s quite amazing. Be.    Wintershard    www.Alt-Religion-Wicca.com

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I talked to the guy I know regarding voice recognition software. He basically says that he’s given up on it because every program sucks. Heh. He said it’s easier for him to just type himself then go through all the hassle. I’ll copy/paste what he wrote below, rather than even attempt to explain the technical schtuff: ~~~~ May I ask you which software you use for e-mail? At the moment I am useing netscape 4.1  but will soon be changeing it to something newer as the screen reader and the people who make the type of program I like have finely made a new system that I can use. What’s netscape? www.google.com Netscape is Google?

Yesh.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I talked to the guy I know regarding voice recognition software. He basically says that he’s given up on it because every program sucks. Heh. He said it’s easier for him to just type himself then go through all the hassle. I’ll copy/paste what he wrote below, rather than even attempt to explain the technical schtuff: ~~~~ May I ask you which software you use for e-mail? At the moment I am useing netscape 4.1  but will soon be changeing it to something newer as the screen reader and the people who make the type of program I like have finely made a new system that I can use. What’s netscape? www.google.com

Netscape is Google?

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I talked to the guy I know regarding voice recognition software. He basically says that he’s given up on it because every program sucks. Heh. He said it’s easier for him to just type himself then go through all the hassle. I’ll copy/paste what he wrote below, rather than even attempt to explain the technical schtuff: ~~~~ May I ask you which software you use for e-mail? At the moment I am useing netscape 4.1  but will soon be changeing it to something newer as the screen reader and the people who make the type of program I like have finely made a new system that I can use.

What’s netscape?

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I talked to the guy I know regarding voice recognition software. He basically says that he’s given up on it because every program sucks. Heh. He said it’s easier for him to just type himself then go through all the hassle. I’ll copy/paste what he wrote below, rather than even attempt to explain the technical schtuff: ~~~~ May I ask you which software you use for e-mail? At the moment I am useing netscape 4.1  but will soon be changeing it to something newer as the screen reader and the people who make the type of program I like have finely made a new system that I can use. What’s netscape?

www.google.com

Response:

I use GW-micro window eyes 4.5 and may soon go to vertion 5.0 It lets me hear what is on the screen and the keys that I type.  With this system I learned to type blind.

   Damn. Now ~that’s~ awesome . Major kudos to him for that determination. Be.    Wintershard    www.Alt-Religion-Wicca.com

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I use GW-micro window eyes 4.5 and may soon go to vertion 5.0 It lets me hear what is on the screen and the keys that I type.  With this system I learned to type blind.   Damn. Now ~that’s~ awesome . Major kudos to him for that determination. Be.   Wintershard   www.Alt-Religion-Wicca.com

He is quite a remarkable person. He even does chat rooms with his software.

Response:

I talked to the guy I know regarding voice recognition software. Thanks Aunty..

No problemo! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – He basically says that he’s given up on it because every program sucks. Heh. He said it’s easier for him to just type himself then go through all the hassle. I’ll copy/paste what he wrote below, rather than even attempt to explain the technical schtuff: ~~~~ May I ask you which software you use for e-mail? At the moment I am useing netscape 4.1  but will soon be changeing it to something newer as the screen reader and the people who make the type of program I like have finely made a new system that I can use. Do you also use voice recognition software for writing? No.  they are not worth it.  So far the big let down is that all of them want you to read certain words in a set time to configure the sound to speach system.  I have two sets of these programs and have tried many more but unless you can memorize about 130 to 250 words and speak them fast and clear it is not worth buying.  even my sighted friends and famly can not get them to work. hmmm.. I found the same problems… It’s a pity, because it would be great help in a number of ways if it worked.. P

Yeah, it’s a shame. You’d think with all the high tech gadgets they have nowadays, a better program would have been created. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a friend that needs a good referrence for a decent program to use. I use GW-micro window eyes 4.5 and may soon go to vertion 5.0 It lets me hear what is on the screen and the keys that I type.  With this system I learned to type blind. This is slow but the best way that I know.  as to my bad spelling that is me as I had dyslexia before I went blind and never got the hang of it.  And the netscape 4.1 and window eyes do not work well togeather.  but this set up lets me do e-mail and news groups better then anything that JAWS or mirosoft ever made yet. Thanks! Your wellcome.

Response:

I talked to the guy I know regarding voice recognition software.

Thanks Aunty.. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – He basically says that he’s given up on it because every program sucks. Heh. He said it’s easier for him to just type himself then go through all the hassle. I’ll copy/paste what he wrote below, rather than even attempt to explain the technical schtuff: ~~~~ May I ask you which software you use for e-mail? At the moment I am useing netscape 4.1  but will soon be changeing it to something newer as the screen reader and the people who make the type of program I like have finely made a new system that I can use. Do you also use voice recognition software for writing? No.  they are not worth it.  So far the big let down is that all of them want you to read certain words in a set time to configure the sound to speach system.  I have two sets of these programs and have tried many more but unless you can memorize about 130 to 250 words and speak them fast and clear it is not worth buying.  even my sighted friends and famly can not get them to work.

hmmm.. I found the same problems… It’s a pity, because it would be great help in a number of ways if it worked.. P – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have a friend that needs a good referrence for a decent program to use. I use GW-micro window eyes 4.5 and may soon go to vertion 5.0 It lets me hear what is on the screen and the keys that I type.  With this system I learned to type blind. This is slow but the best way that I know.  as to my bad spelling that is me as I had dyslexia before I went blind and never got the hang of it.  And the netscape 4.1 and window eyes do not work well togeather.  but this set up lets me do e-mail and news groups better then anything that JAWS or mirosoft ever made yet. Thanks! Your wellcome.

Response:

I talked to the guy I know regarding voice recognition software. He basically says that he’s given up on it because every program sucks. Heh. He said it’s easier for him to just type himself then go through all the hassle. I’ll copy/paste what he wrote below, rather than even attempt to explain the technical schtuff: ~~~~ May I ask you which software you use for e-mail?

At the moment I am useing netscape 4.1  but will soon be changeing it to something newer as the screen reader and the people who make the type of program I like have finely made a new system that I can use. Do you also use voice recognition software for writing?

No.  they are not worth it.  So far the big let down is that all of them want you to read certain words in a set time to configure the sound to speach system.  I have two sets of these programs and have tried many more but unless you can memorize about 130 to 250 words and speak them fast and clear it is not worth buying.  even my sighted friends and famly can not get them to work. I have a friend that needs a good referrence for a decent program to use.

I use GW-micro window eyes 4.5 and may soon go to vertion 5.0 It lets me hear what is on the screen and the keys that I type.  With this system I learned to type blind. This is slow but the best way that I know.  as to my bad spelling that is me as I had dyslexia before I went blind and never got the hang of it.  And the netscape 4.1 and window eyes do not work well togeather.  but this set up lets me do e-mail and news groups better then anything that JAWS or mirosoft ever made yet. Thanks!

Your wellcome.

Response: