Question:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Stan de SD says… says… http://www.fringefolk.com/joinfringe.html JOIN THE FRINGE "Fringefolk" is an online directory of people who believe that Bush is not a legitimate president and has no mandate to push through an extreme right-wing agenda. You can help us show a solid, unified front by joining the Fringefolk directory and taking part in our online, peaceful protest. You don’t need signs and you don’t need to give up your weekends (though I encourage you to participate in every demonstration of like-minded people in your area); you merely need to send me your NAME, AGE, OCCUPATION, LOCATION (city, state, zip) and a scanned PHOTOGRAPH. I will add you to the online protest. I’m sure Bush’s Schutz-Staffel is pleased to have such an easily accessible list of "combatants." They will probably issue some new playing cards with the pictures from the web site and disappear them all one by one. Well, I’m not as deeply caught up in Liberal Paranoia as you seem to be, but I will admit that one by one the Democrats keep losing seats in the House and the Senate, with each new election. Maybe the Republicans are using playing cards with Demmie pictures on them to accomplish that goal? Maybe Republicans are figuring out how to control access to ballots and access to voting counts. Maybe you’re a nutcake, and people are realizing that people who share your political views have some issues dealing with reality… That’s a Stalinist tactic you’re using there: painting people who see things differently from you as psychologically unstable.
Actually they may be psychological stable. Sociopaths and narcissistic types are stable in their points of view.
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – http://www.fringefolk.com/joinfringe.html PLEASE NOTE – the photos are the most important part of this protest. They show that we represent a widely diverse group of people, not some nebulous "fringe" element. Then your site is horrifically mis-named. You should try "mainstreamamericans.com". You might get taken more seriously. -b
For the record, it’s not my site. But I did join it a long time ago. I was just looking at it again today and noticed that about 100 more people joined it since I last looked last fall.
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Stan de SD says… says… http://www.fringefolk.com/joinfringe.html JOIN THE FRINGE "Fringefolk" is an online directory of people who believe that Bush is not a legitimate president and has no mandate to push through an extreme right-wing agenda. You can help us show a solid, unified front by joining the Fringefolk directory and taking part in our online, peaceful protest. You don’t need signs and you don’t need to give up your weekends (though I encourage you to participate in every demonstration of like-minded people in your area); you merely need to send me your NAME, AGE, OCCUPATION, LOCATION (city, state, zip) and a scanned PHOTOGRAPH. I will add you to the online protest. I’m sure Bush’s Schutz-Staffel is pleased to have such an easily accessible list of "combatants." They will probably issue some new playing cards with the pictures from the web site and disappear them all one by one. Well, I’m not as deeply caught up in Liberal Paranoia as you seem to be, but I will admit that one by one the Democrats keep losing seats in the House and the Senate, with each new election. Maybe the Republicans are using playing cards with Demmie pictures on them to accomplish that goal? Maybe Republicans are figuring out how to control access to ballots and access to voting counts. Maybe you’re a nutcake, and people are realizing that people who share your political views have some issues dealing with reality… That’s a Stalinist tactic you’re using there: painting people who see things differently from you as psychologically unstable. No more "Stalinist" than painting Republicans as people who "control access to ballets and access to voting counts", of course. Which is why you Democrats continue to look stupid in these discussions, in addition to continuing to lose elections, xofpi.
I never said Republicans control access to ballets. Square dances maybe. Ballets, definitely not.
Response:
http://www.fringefolk.com/joinfringe.html PLEASE NOTE – the photos are the most important part of this protest. They show that we represent a widely diverse group of people, not some nebulous "fringe" element.
Then your site is horrifically mis-named. You should try "mainstreamamericans.com". You might get taken more seriously. -b
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Stan de SD says… says… http://www.fringefolk.com/joinfringe.html JOIN THE FRINGE "Fringefolk" is an online directory of people who believe that Bush is not a legitimate president and has no mandate to push through an extreme right-wing agenda. You can help us show a solid, unified front by joining the Fringefolk directory and taking part in our online, peaceful protest. You don’t need signs and you don’t need to give up your weekends (though I encourage you to participate in every demonstration of like-minded people in your area); you merely need to send me your NAME, AGE, OCCUPATION, LOCATION (city, state, zip) and a scanned PHOTOGRAPH. I will add you to the online protest. I’m sure Bush’s Schutz-Staffel is pleased to have such an easily accessible list of "combatants." They will probably issue some new playing cards with the pictures from the web site and disappear them all one by one. Well, I’m not as deeply caught up in Liberal Paranoia as you seem to be, but I will admit that one by one the Democrats keep losing seats in the House and the Senate, with each new election. Maybe the Republicans are using playing cards with Demmie pictures on them to accomplish that goal? Maybe Republicans are figuring out how to control access to ballots and access to voting counts. Maybe you’re a nutcake, and people are realizing that people who share your political views have some issues dealing with reality… That’s a Stalinist tactic you’re using there: painting people who see things differently from you as psychologically unstable. No more "Stalinist" than painting Republicans as people who "control access to ballets and access to voting counts", of course. Which is why you Democrats continue to look stupid in these discussions, in addition to continuing to lose elections, xofpi.
Oh yea what about Mary Landrieu? Bush campaigned for her real hard and she handed that Bush bitch Terrell her ass. Pretty soon you will be shutting that silly little mouth of yours and hiding behind yet another name. Rene you lose more debates in this newsgroup than anyone I’ve ever seen. Your dumb but you don’t know your dumb. I pity a fool like you. You are Lee Atwater’s wet dream of a voter. John John
Response:
If you feel that George W. Bush is not a legitimate President –
Notice the use of the word "feel" instead of "think"… whether because of the unconstitutional U.S. Supreme Court decision,
What decision was that, and how was it "unconstitutional"? Cites, please. or voting ‘irregularities’ (intimidation, fraud and more)
You mean individuals who couldn’t figure out how to punch a ballot? The solution was easy – nullify all double-punched ballots. However, the Lefty Liberals wanted to be able to divine "intent" from them… in Florida and other states,
Illinois, where the dead (not the hippies from CA) represent an important Dem voting bloc? or the fact that Al Gore received more votes nationwide,
Given that electoral votes determine the president, why does that even matter? or for any other reason stemming from the 2000 election,
Like not liking the outcome? then you are – according to Bush and the mainstream media – "on the
fringe". If the show fits, wear it. "Fringefolk" is an online directory of people who believe that Bush is not a legitimate president and has no mandate to push through an extreme right-wing agenda.
You will probably find that a lot of these people believe in Gaia, Psychic Friends, and ear candling as well. Birds of a feather…
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – says… http://www.fringefolk.com/joinfringe.html JOIN THE FRINGE "Fringefolk" is an online directory of people who believe that Bush is not a legitimate president and has no mandate to push through an extreme right-wing agenda. You can help us show a solid, unified front by joining the Fringefolk directory and taking part in our online, peaceful protest. You don’t need signs and you don’t need to give up your weekends (though I encourage you to participate in every demonstration of like-minded people in your area); you merely need to send me your NAME, AGE, OCCUPATION, LOCATION (city, state, zip) and a scanned PHOTOGRAPH. I will add you to the online protest. I’m sure Bush’s Schutz-Staffel is pleased to have such an easily accessible list of "combatants." They will probably issue some new playing cards with the pictures from the web site and disappear them all one by one. Well, I’m not as deeply caught up in Liberal Paranoia as you seem to be, but I will admit that one by one the Democrats keep losing seats in the House and the Senate, with each new election. Maybe the Republicans are using playing cards with Demmie pictures on them to accomplish that goal? Maybe Republicans are figuring out how to control access to ballots and access to voting counts.
Maybe you’re a nutcake, and people are realizing that people who share your political views have some issues dealing with reality…
Response:
SD says… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – says… http://www.fringefolk.com/joinfringe.html JOIN THE FRINGE "Fringefolk" is an online directory of people who believe that Bush is not a legitimate president and has no mandate to push through an extreme right-wing agenda. You can help us show a solid, unified front by joining the Fringefolk directory and taking part in our online, peaceful protest. You don’t need signs and you don’t need to give up your weekends (though I encourage you to participate in every demonstration of like-minded people in your area); you merely need to send me your NAME, AGE, OCCUPATION, LOCATION (city, state, zip) and a scanned PHOTOGRAPH. I will add you to the online protest. I’m sure Bush’s Schutz-Staffel is pleased to have such an easily accessible list of "combatants." They will probably issue some new playing cards with the pictures from the web site and disappear them all one by one. Well, I’m not as deeply caught up in Liberal Paranoia as you seem to be, but I will admit that one by one the Democrats keep losing seats in the House and the Senate, with each new election. Maybe the Republicans are using playing cards with Demmie pictures on them to accomplish that goal? Maybe Republicans are figuring out how to control access to ballots and access to voting counts. Maybe you’re a nutcake, and people are realizing that people who share your political views have some issues dealing with reality…
That’s a Stalinist tactic you’re using there: painting people who see things differently from you as psychologically unstable.
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If you feel that George W. Bush is not a legitimate President – Notice the use of the word "feel" instead of "think"… whether because of the unconstitutional U.S. Supreme Court decision, What decision was that, and how was it "unconstitutional"? Cites, please. or voting ‘irregularities’ (intimidation, fraud and more) You mean individuals who couldn’t figure out how to punch a ballot? The solution was easy – nullify all double-punched ballots. However, the Lefty Liberals wanted to be able to divine "intent" from them… in Florida and other states, Illinois, where the dead (not the hippies from CA) represent an important Dem voting bloc? or the fact that Al Gore received more votes nationwide, Given that electoral votes determine the president, why does that even matter? or for any other reason stemming from the 2000 election, Like not liking the outcome? then you are – according to Bush and the mainstream media – "on the fringe". If the show fits, wear it. "Fringefolk" is an online directory of people who believe that Bush is not a legitimate president and has no mandate to push through an extreme right-wing agenda. You will probably find that a lot of these people believe in Gaia, Psychic Friends, and ear candling as well. Birds of a feather…
You left out pink hair and nose rings.
Response:
whether because of the unconstitutional U.S. Supreme Court decision, What decision was that, and how was it "unconstitutional"? Cites, please.
http://www.tompaine.com/feature.cfm/ID/7632/ The Supreme Court vs. The American People An Interview With Constitutional Scholar Jamin Raskin Steven Rosenfeld is a commentary editor and audio producer for TomPaine.com. Jamin Raskin is a professor of constitutional law at American University. As a public-interest lawyer defending "the right to democracy," he has represented the Rev. Jesse Jackson, Ross Perot, Greenpeace, United Students Against Sweatshops and many others. His latest book, Overruling Democracy: The Supreme Court vs. The American People, contends the current court is one of the most activist courts in U.S. history and should not be exempt from criticism by either candidates for federal office or the public. TomPaine.com’s Steven Rosenfeld spoke with Raskin. TomPaine.com: You write that the Supreme Court has a very different view of democracy, democratic institutions, civil rights and corporate power than that held by most Americans. What do most Americans believe about their country that is out of sync with the Supreme Court? Jamin Raskin: People believe there is a constitutional right to vote. People believe there is a constitutional right to an education. Most people assume that states have to guarantee equal funding for public schools. All of those beliefs are rejected by the Supreme Court. TP.c: And when you say rejected, what you’re talking about here is a pattern. So when you write that the current Supreme Court is "a historic disappointment, or in some respects a nightmare," you are talking about a pattern of decisions, right? Raskin: It is important to see that the Supreme Court has been a conservative or reactionary institution for most of our history. In the 18th century it did nothing to enlarge or deepen democracy. In the 19th century, it found in the Dred Scott decision that African-Americans could not be citizens within the meaning of our Constitution. In 1896, even after equal protection was added to the Constitution, the Court upheld governmental segregation of public accomodations. In the 20th century, the court adhered to "seperate but equal" all the way up until 1954. In the first several decades of the 20th century, it struck down dozens of progressive federal and state laws regulating the work place and the economy. So, we had a brief period of progressive constitutionalism during the Warren Court. The Warren Court spelled out the principle of "one person, one vote," which should be the organizing principle of political democracy. The Rehnquist Court has abandoned that vision. TP.c: When you say that they have abandoned that vision, you are talking about what kind of decisions? Raskin: The Supreme Court has repeatedly intervened to deform and distort the political process. The most spectacular example is Bush v. Gore. The most interesting part of that decision to me was the sentence in which the court says there is no federally protected constitutional right to vote. The Court essentially denied the right that most people assume is at the heart of democracy. The Court said that the right to vote in presidential elections really belongs to the states who can appoint electors, and the Court made it clear that if Florida or any other state wanted to get rid of the popular vote or disregard it, they could do so. TP.c: Just to refresh people’s memory, the Court stopped the recount in Florida, and then it said that counting all the votes would somehow harm the credibility of the president. Raskin: Yeah. What happened was the Florida Supreme Court ordered that 175,000 ballots that were not counted by the machines be counted by hand, which is the way that every state in the Union performs a recount. The Supreme Court intervened for the first time in American history to halt the counting of ballots. The Court said that there was a hypothetical possibility that certain ballots might be treated differently in one county than in another. Amazingly, the remedy for the potential loss of a few votes was the guaranteed disenfranchisement of tens of thousands of people, and of course this makes no sense. The court essentially admits that it makes no sense by declaring that the case has no precedential value for any other case in the future. TP.c: You say that behind Bush v. Gore lies "a thick and unprincipled jurisprudence hostile to popular democracy, and protective of race privilege and corporate power." Is the Court as classist and racist as you are describing? Raskin: Well, it’s not back to Plessy v. Ferguson, but it has returned much closer to the old baseline of Supreme Court politics. I have a chapter describing the Supreme Court’s racial double standard in redistricting decisions, and this is a line of cases that leads right up to Bush v. Gore. It started in 1993 with Shaw v. Reno, where the Supreme Court upheld an equal protection attack by a group of white voters in North Carolina — led by a professor of constitutional law at Duke [University] — who felt aggrieved by virtue of being put into a majority black district. They asserted that equal protection was violated because their district had what they called "a bizarre appearance" on the map. Most constitutional lawyers in the country thought this was ridiculous. After all, the Supreme Court had always said that there is no constitutional requirement that districts be a perfect circle or square or triangle, or any recognizable geometric figure. These white voters in North Carolina had all of the same rights that black voters had in majority white districts: They have a right to vote, run for office, to campaign and to contribute money. It was hard to see even what the injury was, which is something the Court insists on fanatically whenever minority plaintiffs come before the court. And yet, amazingly in one of the by now famous 5 to 4 decisions, the conservative block in the court decided that this equal protection challenge by white voters set forth a valid claim. The Court has proceeded to dismantle dozens of majority African-American and Hispanic congressional and state legislative districts. This has been a major blow to the process of deepening and strengthening American democracy. Amazingly, the conservative justices have described the most integrated districts in the history of many states, such as the districts in North Carolina, as apartheid or segregated districts. So there’s a kind of moral dyslexia going on in the Court. TP.c: If you say the Court has been more conservative than the popular mainstream for most of American history, is this particular court among the most activist and regressive, or is it somewhat consistent with [Supreme] Courts in the past? Raskin: This court is easily as reactionary and activist as the Lochner Court was, and the Lochner Court is held up as the most activist Court in our history. But look at the progessive laws that were stripped down or gutted by the Rehnquist Court: the Violence Against Women Act, the Age Discrimination and Employment Act, the Religious Freedom and Restoration Act, the Gun Free School Zones Act, federal affirmative action policies and so on. The appalling thing is that, in the name of fighting judicial activism, the Republican party has engineered the most extreme judicial activism that we have seen in almost a century. TP.c: Why hasn’t there been more public outcry or criticism of these rulings? Raskin: Part of it is the cult of the robe. People think that somehow the Supreme Court is outside of democratic politics. It is not. Bush v. Gore showed that it can slide from a fairly high level of ideological politics down into the mud of partisan politics. We need to demystify the court, and what I hope my book does is to show people that constitutional reasoning is not a different kind of thinking, but that it is just regular logical analysis carried over to law. Anybody can understand it, anybody can read it and everybody really needs to pay attention. We are really undergoing a full-blown assault on the institutions of political democracy. TP.c: Well that’s what you write, and ultimately, it is a constitutional crisis of the sort where the principles that people think are foundational are not those being upheld by the highest court. Raskin: Totally. The country began as a slave republic of Christian white-male property owners over the age of 21. We have expanded and deepened democracy only through political struggle and constitutional amendment. The Reconstruction amendments abolished slavery and gave us equal protection and black suffrage. The 19th Amendment gave us women’s suffrage. The 17th Amendment gave us direct election of senators. The 23rd Amendment gave [Washington], D.C. residents the right to participate in presidential elections. The 24th Amendment abolished poll taxes. The 26th Amendment lowered the voting age to 18. The Supreme Court, rather than contributing to democratization, has usually resisted it at every turn. The great victory of the Warren Court, as Chief Justice Warren himself said, was the definition of the "one person, one vote" principle, and the Rehnquist court has left that principle in tatters. So, with one party control of the House, the Senate, the White House and the Supreme Court itself, we need to get back to constitutional basics. This is why I say, we need to examine the constitutional anatomy of our political maladies today. We need to get back to constitutional politics. I think the liberals have turned into the worst constitutional conservatives, because liberals are afraid about the Flag Desecration Amendment, the School Prayer Amendment, and the Ten Commandments Amendment. They want to treat the Constitution like an antique in the … read more »
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – http://www.fringefolk.com/joinfringe.html JOIN THE FRINGE "Fringefolk" is an online directory of people who believe that Bush is not a legitimate president and has no mandate to push through an extreme right-wing agenda. You can help us show a solid, unified front by joining the Fringefolk directory and taking part in our online, peaceful protest. You don’t need signs and you don’t need to give up your weekends (though I encourage you to participate in every demonstration of like-minded people in your area); you merely need to send me your NAME, AGE, OCCUPATION, LOCATION (city, state, zip) and a scanned PHOTOGRAPH. I will add you to the online protest.
I’m sure Bush’s Schutz-Staffel is pleased to have such an easily accessible list of "combatants." They will probably issue some new playing cards with the pictures from the web site and disappear them all one by one.
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – SD says… says… http://www.fringefolk.com/joinfringe.html JOIN THE FRINGE "Fringefolk" is an online directory of people who believe that Bush is not a legitimate president and has no mandate to push through an extreme right-wing agenda. You can help us show a solid, unified front by joining the Fringefolk directory and taking part in our online, peaceful protest. You don’t need signs and you don’t need to give up your weekends (though I encourage you to participate in every demonstration of like-minded people in your area); you merely need to send me your NAME, AGE, OCCUPATION, LOCATION (city, state, zip) and a scanned PHOTOGRAPH. I will add you to the online protest. I’m sure Bush’s Schutz-Staffel is pleased to have such an easily accessible list of "combatants." They will probably issue some new playing cards with the pictures from the web site and disappear them all one by one. Well, I’m not as deeply caught up in Liberal Paranoia as you seem to be, but I will admit that one by one the Democrats keep losing seats in the House and the Senate, with each new election. Maybe the Republicans are using playing cards with Demmie pictures on them to accomplish that goal? Maybe Republicans are figuring out how to control access to ballots and access to voting counts. Maybe you’re a nutcake, and people are realizing that people who share your political views have some issues dealing with reality… That’s a Stalinist tactic you’re using there: painting people who see things differently from you as psychologically unstable.
That’s Stain for you. If you disagree with him, off to the Gulag with you. — "To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." Teddy Roosevelt
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Stan de SD says… says… http://www.fringefolk.com/joinfringe.html JOIN THE FRINGE "Fringefolk" is an online directory of people who believe that Bush is not a legitimate president and has no mandate to push through an extreme right-wing agenda. You can help us show a solid, unified front by joining the Fringefolk directory and taking part in our online, peaceful protest. You don’t need signs and you don’t need to give up your weekends (though I encourage you to participate in every demonstration of like-minded people in your area); you merely need to send me your NAME, AGE, OCCUPATION, LOCATION (city, state, zip) and a scanned PHOTOGRAPH. I will add you to the online protest. I’m sure Bush’s Schutz-Staffel is pleased to have such an easily accessible list of "combatants." They will probably issue some new playing cards with the pictures from the web site and disappear them all one by one. Well, I’m not as deeply caught up in Liberal Paranoia as you seem to be, but I will admit that one by one the Democrats keep losing seats in the House and the Senate, with each new election. Maybe the Republicans are using playing cards with Demmie pictures on them to accomplish that goal? Maybe Republicans are figuring out how to control access to ballots and access to voting counts. Maybe you’re a nutcake, and people are realizing that people who share your political views have some issues dealing with reality… That’s a Stalinist tactic you’re using there: painting people who see things differently from you as psychologically unstable.
No more "Stalinist" than painting Republicans as people who "control access to ballets and access to voting counts", of course. Which is why you Democrats continue to look stupid in these discussions, in addition to continuing to lose elections, xofpi.
Response:
says… Well, I’m not as deeply caught up in Liberal Paranoia as you seem to be, but I will admit that one by one the Democrats keep losing seats in the House and the Senate, with each new election. Maybe the Republicans are using playing cards with Demmie pictures on them to accomplish that goal? Maybe Republicans are figuring out how to control access to ballots and access to voting counts.
If so, they have had that figured out ever since 1992, since that was the last time the Democrats were able to win an election for control of the House, and the House is the ONLY branch of our government which is apportioned on the basis of the Popular Vote! Apparently the Democrats simply CANNOT figure out how to trick the American people into voting Democrat! Tough luck, Demmies.
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – whether because of the unconstitutional U.S. Supreme Court decision, What decision was that, and how was it "unconstitutional"? Cites, please. http://www.tompaine.com/feature.cfm/ID/7632/ The Supreme Court vs. The American People An Interview With Constitutional Scholar Jamin Raskin Steven Rosenfeld is a commentary editor and audio producer for TomPaine.com. Jamin Raskin is a professor of constitutional law at American University. As a public-interest lawyer defending "the right to democracy," he has represented the Rev. Jesse Jackson, Ross Perot, Greenpeace, United Students Against Sweatshops and many others. His latest book, Overruling Democracy: The Supreme Court vs. The American People, contends the current court is one of the most activist courts in U.S. history and should not be exempt from criticism by either candidates for federal office or the public. TomPaine.com’s Steven Rosenfeld spoke with Raskin. TomPaine.com: You write that the Supreme Court has a very different view of democracy, democratic institutions, civil rights and corporate power than that held by most Americans. What do most Americans believe about their country that is out of sync with the Supreme Court? Jamin Raskin: People believe there is a constitutional right to vote. People believe there is a constitutional right to an education. Most people assume that states have to guarantee equal funding for public schools. All of those beliefs are rejected by the Supreme Court. TP.c: And when you say rejected, what you’re talking about here is a pattern. So when you write that the current Supreme Court is "a historic disappointment, or in some respects a nightmare," you are talking about a pattern of decisions, right? Raskin: It is important to see that the Supreme Court has been a conservative or reactionary institution for most of our history. In the 18th century it did nothing to enlarge or deepen democracy. In the 19th century, it found in the Dred Scott decision that African-Americans could not be citizens within the meaning of our Constitution. In 1896, even after equal protection was added to the Constitution, the Court upheld governmental segregation of public accomodations. In the 20th century, the court adhered to "seperate but equal" all the way up until 1954. In the first several decades of the 20th century, it struck down dozens of progressive federal and state laws regulating the work place and the economy. So, we had a brief period of progressive constitutionalism during the Warren Court. The Warren Court spelled out the principle of "one person, one vote," which should be the organizing principle of political democracy. The Rehnquist Court has abandoned that vision. TP.c: When you say that they have abandoned that vision, you are talking about what kind of decisions? Raskin: The Supreme Court has repeatedly intervened to deform and distort the political process. The most spectacular example is Bush v. Gore. The most interesting part of that decision to me was the sentence in which the court says there is no federally protected constitutional right to vote. The Court essentially denied the right that most people assume is at the heart of democracy. The Court said that the right to vote in presidential elections really belongs to the states who can appoint electors, and the Court made it clear that if Florida or any other state wanted to get rid of the popular vote or disregard it, they could do so. TP.c: Just to refresh people’s memory, the Court stopped the recount in Florida, and then it said that counting all the votes would somehow harm the credibility of the president. Raskin: Yeah. What happened was the Florida Supreme Court ordered that 175,000 ballots that were not counted by the machines be counted by hand, which is the way that every state in the Union performs a recount. The Supreme Court intervened for the first time in American history to halt the counting of ballots. The Court said that there was a hypothetical possibility that certain ballots might be treated differently in one county than in another. Amazingly, the remedy for the potential loss of a few votes was the guaranteed disenfranchisement of tens of thousands of people, and of course this makes no sense. The court essentially admits that it makes no sense by declaring that the case has no precedential value for any other case in the future. TP.c: You say that behind Bush v. Gore lies "a thick and unprincipled jurisprudence hostile to popular democracy, and protective of race privilege and corporate power." Is the Court as classist and racist as you are describing? Raskin: Well, it’s not back to Plessy v. Ferguson, but it has returned much closer to the old baseline of Supreme Court politics. I have a chapter describing the Supreme Court’s racial double standard in redistricting decisions, and this is a line of cases that leads right up to Bush v. Gore. It started in 1993 with Shaw v. Reno, where the Supreme Court upheld an equal protection attack by a group of white voters in North Carolina — led by a professor of constitutional law at Duke [University] — who felt aggrieved by virtue of being put into a majority black district. They asserted that equal protection was violated because their district had what they called "a bizarre appearance" on the map. Most constitutional lawyers in the country thought this was ridiculous. After all, the Supreme Court had always said that there is no constitutional requirement that districts be a perfect circle or square or triangle, or any recognizable geometric figure. These white voters in North Carolina had all of the same rights that black voters had in majority white districts: They have a right to vote, run for office, to campaign and to contribute money. It was hard to see even what the injury was, which is something the Court insists on fanatically whenever minority plaintiffs come before the court. And yet, amazingly in one of the by now famous 5 to 4 decisions, the conservative block in the court decided that this equal protection challenge by white voters set forth a valid claim. The Court has proceeded to dismantle dozens of majority African-American and Hispanic congressional and state legislative districts. This has been a major blow to the process of deepening and strengthening American democracy. Amazingly, the conservative justices have described the most integrated districts in the history of many states, such as the districts in North Carolina, as apartheid or segregated districts. So there’s a kind of moral dyslexia going on in the Court. TP.c: If you say the Court has been more conservative than the popular mainstream for most of American history, is this particular court among the most activist and regressive, or is it somewhat consistent with [Supreme] Courts in the past? Raskin: This court is easily as reactionary and activist as the Lochner Court was, and the Lochner Court is held up as the most activist Court in our history. But look at the progessive laws that were stripped down or gutted by the Rehnquist Court: the Violence Against Women Act, the Age Discrimination and Employment Act, the Religious Freedom and Restoration Act, the Gun Free School Zones Act, federal affirmative action policies and so on. The appalling thing is that, in the name of fighting judicial activism, the Republican party has engineered the most extreme judicial activism that we have seen in almost a century. TP.c: Why hasn’t there been more public outcry or criticism of these rulings? Raskin: Part of it is the cult of the robe. People think that somehow the Supreme Court is outside of democratic politics. It is not. Bush v. Gore showed that it can slide from a fairly high level of ideological politics down into the mud of partisan politics. We need to demystify the court, and what I hope my book does is to show people that constitutional reasoning is not a different kind of thinking, but that it is just regular logical analysis carried over to law. Anybody can understand it, anybody can read it and everybody really needs to pay attention. We are really undergoing a full-blown assault on the institutions of political democracy. TP.c: Well that’s what you write, and ultimately, it is a constitutional crisis of the sort where the principles that people think are foundational are not those being upheld by the highest court. Raskin: Totally. The country began as a slave republic of Christian white-male property owners over the age of 21. We have expanded and deepened democracy only through political struggle and constitutional amendment. The Reconstruction amendments abolished slavery and gave us equal protection and black suffrage. The 19th Amendment gave us women’s suffrage. The 17th Amendment gave us direct election of senators. The 23rd Amendment gave [Washington], D.C. residents the right to participate in presidential elections. The 24th Amendment abolished poll taxes. The 26th Amendment lowered the voting age to 18. The Supreme Court, rather than contributing to democratization, has usually resisted it at every turn. The great victory of the Warren Court, as Chief Justice Warren himself said, was the definition of the "one person, one vote" principle, and the Rehnquist court has left that principle in tatters. So, with one party control of the House, the Senate, the White House and the Supreme Court itself, we need to get back to
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – says… http://www.fringefolk.com/joinfringe.html JOIN THE FRINGE "Fringefolk" is an online directory of people who believe that Bush is not a legitimate president and has no mandate to push through an extreme right-wing agenda. You can help us show a solid, unified front by joining the Fringefolk directory and taking part in our online, peaceful protest. You don’t need signs and you don’t need to give up your weekends (though I encourage you to participate in every demonstration of like-minded people in your area); you merely need to send me your NAME, AGE, OCCUPATION, LOCATION (city, state, zip) and a scanned PHOTOGRAPH. I will add you to the online protest. I’m sure Bush’s Schutz-Staffel is pleased to have such an easily accessible list of "combatants." They will probably issue some new playing cards with the pictures from the web site and disappear them all one by one. Well, I’m not as deeply caught up in Liberal Paranoia as you seem to be, but I will admit that one by one the Democrats keep losing seats in the House and the Senate, with each new election. Maybe the Republicans are using playing cards with Demmie pictures on them to accomplish that goal? Maybe Republicans are figuring out how to control access to ballots and access to voting counts.
Or just maybe, God forbid, you really are on the fringe left and have all kinds of strange "fantasies." Perish the thought… lol. Not really… it appears you’re just still suffering from Hanging Chad Fever. Symptoms are as follows: –General paranoia –Severe memory loss regarding vote counts –Inability to count Bush votes –Seeing Gore votes that are not really there –Recurring dreams where Jeb Bush guys in white hoods chase away Black voters (even though Blacks set a record turn-out in Florida 2000) –Recurring dreams about Janet Reno (always sexual in nature) –Phobic fear or uncontrollable repulsion at hearing the names Rush Limbaugh or Ronald Reagan –Severe convulsions at hearing the name Judge Scalia; spitting often accompanies these episodes There are many other symptoms, but those are the most common complaints. Sorry… there is no real cure for Hanging Chad Fever. Dr John
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – http://www.fringefolk.com/joinfringe.html JOIN THE FRINGE "Fringefolk" is an online directory of people who believe that Bush is not a legitimate president and has no mandate to push through an extreme right-wing agenda. You can help us show a solid, unified front by joining the Fringefolk directory and taking part in our online, peaceful protest. You don’t need signs and you don’t need to give up your weekends (though I encourage you to participate in every demonstration of like-minded people in your area); you merely need to send me your NAME, AGE, OCCUPATION, LOCATION (city, state, zip) and a scanned PHOTOGRAPH. I will add you to the online protest. I’m sure Bush’s Schutz-Staffel is pleased to have such an easily accessible list of "combatants." They will probably issue some new playing cards with the pictures from the web site and disappear them all one by one. Well, I’m not as deeply caught up in Liberal Paranoia as you seem to be, but I will admit that one by one the Democrats keep losing seats in the House and the Senate, with each new election. Maybe the Republicans are using playing cards with Demmie pictures on them to accomplish that goal?
Maybe Republicans are figuring out how to control access to ballots and access to voting counts.
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – http://www.fringefolk.com/joinfringe.html JOIN THE FRINGE "Fringefolk" is an online directory of people who believe that Bush is not a legitimate president and has no mandate to push through an extreme right-wing agenda. You can help us show a solid, unified front by joining the Fringefolk directory and taking part in our online, peaceful protest. You don’t need signs and you don’t need to give up your weekends (though I encourage you to participate in every demonstration of like-minded people in your area); you merely need to send me your NAME, AGE, OCCUPATION, LOCATION (city, state, zip) and a scanned PHOTOGRAPH. I will add you to the online protest. I’m sure Bush’s Schutz-Staffel is pleased to have such an easily accessible list of "combatants." They will probably issue some new playing cards with the pictures from the web site and disappear them all one by one.
Well, I’m not as deeply caught up in Liberal Paranoia as you seem to be, but I will admit that one by one the Democrats keep losing seats in the House and the Senate, with each new election. Maybe the Republicans are using playing cards with Demmie pictures on them to accomplish that goal?
Response:
http://www.fringefolk.com/joinfringe.html JOIN THE FRINGE If you feel that George W. Bush is not a legitimate President – whether because of the unconstitutional U.S. Supreme Court decision, or voting ‘irregularities’ (intimidation, fraud and more) in Florida and other states, or the fact that Al Gore received more votes nationwide, or for any other reason stemming from the 2000 election, then you are – according to Bush and the mainstream media – "on the fringe". "Fringefolk" is an online directory of people who believe that Bush is not a legitimate president and has no mandate to push through an extreme right-wing agenda. You can help us show a solid, unified front by joining the Fringefolk directory and taking part in our online, peaceful protest. You don’t need signs and you don’t need to give up your weekends (though I encourage you to participate in every demonstration of like-minded people in your area); you merely need to send me your NAME, AGE, OCCUPATION, LOCATION (city, state, zip) and a scanned PHOTOGRAPH. I will add you to the online protest. You can even add a PERSONAL STATEMENT (as long as it’s no more than 25-50 words). You don’t need to send me your street address or telephone number (in fact, I’d rather you didn’t, since you shouldn’t share that information with anyone online). AN IMPORTANT NOTE: I have had a few people write to me to say that they’re reluctant to give out their age, or their occupation, or (because they live in a very small town) their location. The reason I ask for so much information is because I think it helps show what a diverse group we are – but the only NECESSARY information for your listing is your name, your state and your photograph. It is absolutely fine, if you live in a small town, to list the nearest big city instead; as for occupation, you can be as general or specific as you like. And listing your age is COMPLETELY optional. If you don’t have a scanned photo of yourself, you can mail a regular photo to me and I’ll scan it for you. Please send it to: Ann "Rose" Thomas P.O. Box 1232 Sun Valley CA 91353 If you need the photo returned, please include a SASE. Along with the photo, please include your name, age, occupation, city/state/zip and a personal statement (try to keep the statement to 25-50 words, if possible). PLEASE NOTE – the photos are the most important part of this protest. They show that we represent a widely diverse group of people, not some nebulous "fringe" element. Please read our mission statement for more information. following (NOTE – please be sure to include all information; I spend an awful lot of time writing back to people who’ve forgotten something): 1. Your NAME (first and last), your AGE (optional), your OCCUPATION (optional), and your CITY/STATE/ZIP (just your state is fine). 2. A scanned PHOTO of yourself in one of the following formats – GIF, JPEG, PICT, BMP OR TIFF; if you can do image editing yourself, please make the photo 75 pixels wide and 75 pixels high (if you can’t, don’t worry – I’ll do it for you). Please try to make the file size as small as possible! If you’re going to be snail mailing the photo, please let me know. I can crop other people/things out of photos, and do minor editing if you desire, so don’t worry if you don’t have a ‘perfect’ photograph. 3. Optional – a personal statement regarding your feelings about Bush/the election (no more than 25-50 words, please) and/or the URL of your website. PLEASE NOTE – I will be out of town until Tuesday, April 23rd. There is NO time commitment when joining the fringe; once you send me your info, you’re done! You’ll be invited to join our announcements mailing list and our discussion mailing list, but those are optional. We’re not in ‘competition’ with any other group – we’re simply a directory of protesters. "If you love wealth better than liberty, the tranquillity of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen." — Samuel Adams
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… ah… and here comes the need for rap music… when ever I get pissy or angry I crank out the rap music… sorta helps set the tone for the mood… Jason 
to send mail). 
that one exam board shouldn’t be able to present such dificulties if others are handling such special arrangements as routine. Is this a private exam board? Can you supply some more details? — School of Artificial Intelligence, Division of Informatics Edinburgh University, 5 Forrest Hill, Edinburgh, EH1 2QL, UK [http://www.dai.ed.ac.uk/daidb/people/homes/cam/ ] DoD #205 
) >One nice thing about egotists: they don’t talk about other people.